Geoff: 0:02

Hello podcats, Geoff Gascoyne here, hope you're well. Today I'm on my way up to central London to do a gig, actually with an old friend of mine, Chris Standring. Chris is a fellow Brit, although he lives in Los Angeles for 30 years or so, made a very good name for himself in the smooth jazz scene, does very well, recently got married. Fantastic guitar player, old friend, and we're going to have a little chat and a little play before the gig and I hope you enjoy the conversation with Chris Standring.

Announcement: 0:47

The Quartet Jazz Standards podcast is brought to you by the Quartet app for iOS, taking your jazz play along to another level.

Geoff: 0:57

Here he is, Chris Standring, hello, hello mate Geoff, how are you, matey? I'm good. Yeah, Are you well?

Chris: 1:02

I'm actually very good.

Geoff: 1:04

yes, no-transcript, that's right you've been living in la for what? 30 years now 34 years coming up this year what made you want to go LA in the first.

Chris: 1:44

Well, you know, this is really a psychiatrist's question, because I was actually quite unhappy living here in the 80s. You know I went to music college. But I did spend some time in California before I went to music college. So the bug had set in a little bit and I was trying to get back there and took a few trips in order for it to happen. And finally in february 1991 I set up some shows over there. From here I booked all my favorite players. I had like five gigs booked at all the major venues in la and a and a seminar at the musicians institute.

Chris: 2:20

And a friend of mine said Chris, why are you coming back? He said you've got more gigs in LA than you got over here. So I slept on that overnight and by the morning I had decided not to come back. I decided to sell up everything and then move to LA. And it was the right thing for me to do because I was actually, as I said, I was actually quite unhappy here for whatever reason, I don't know, I think as a youngster I naturally assumed that things would move quicker than they were destined to do and I thought you know I'm not patient enough to wait 20 years for things to happen in London. You know right. Also, I was very much in the show scene, like everybody was, and I saw the writing on the wall.

Geoff: 3:02

I thought I don't want to be doing this for 60 years, you know so when you went over there, what, what kind of music were you making when you first started?

Chris: 3:08

well, when I first, uh, went over there, I had a band and I had charts. You know, I was a like a budding arranger, just like you were at the time, you know. And, uh, I just put a band together and you know, I mean, I I knew I was learning, but I wanted a vehicle to keep composing and arranging and working on new ideas. You know, and here's the thing, back in 1980, when I spent a little bit of time in LA, I went to the baked potato to see Larry Carlton play, and you know the baby so it's tiny, yeah, right, because we've been there, yeah, yeah. And right behind me there was Robin Ford, a very young robin ford. He was like 27 years old and I was 20. And I'd just seen the yellow jackets play the week before at that very club and I was blown away. I thought this is extraordinary.

Geoff: 3:57

This is what I want to do for anyone who doesn't know, the baked potato is at the tiniest little dive club, isn't it? It's near your house, isn't it in North Hollywood house? Isn't it In North Hollywood? Yeah?

Chris: 4:06

Anyway. So while we were waiting for Larry to play, I turned round and said Robin, I saw you play last week, man, you were just fantastic and he was super nice, you know. And I said I've got a question for you. I'm going back to London, I'm going to music college for three years, but I actually want to end up doing exactly what you're doing. Have you got any advice for me? I can't believe I actually had the balls to ask me this.

Chris: 4:31

Anyway, he said well, I do. Uh, I think what you should do is go back to London and put a band together and just call everybody you know who's really really good good and have the band sound fantastic. And if you can play really really well, you'll be showcased and people will call you. I thought that's a really good idea. So I went back and guess what? I became a bloody band leader. I didn't become a guy that people called. I mean, I got some calls, but people started calling me and said I really want to come and do your band. And I thought I'm not sure if Robin's advice was right on the money, because he's a band leader. Do you know what I mean it's? So I did end up becoming just like him.

Geoff: 5:14

He wasn't a band leader to start with. He started nobody.

Chris: 5:17

He was in the Yellow Jacket, he was in the Yellow Jackets and for contractual reasons he had to get out of that band. Yeah, and he went solo and he got a nice deal with Warner Brothers and you know he wasn't really that keen to be a studio guitar player, you know he wasn't that kind of a guy, um, and so he was destined to be an artist and I was destined to be an artist. So I love his advice in hindsight, but at the time it was wrong. Do you know what?

Geoff: 5:43

I mean yeah, wow, when did you grow, wow, where did?

Chris: 5:45

you grow up? Where did you? Alesbury in Buckinghamshire, okay, yeah. So I had local guitar lessons and I went to community college and um failed a level music and in order to get into music college I had to take grade eight, because I know you play classical guitar were you playing classical time?

Geoff: 6:02

yes, I was I was.

Chris: 6:03

That was my thing for many, many years. Love it, but no, but knowing that I kind of didn't want to be that guy. You know, I wanted to be a jazz guy but I just studied jazz on my own. I never took one jazz guitar lesson in my entire life until about uh 10 years ago when I took a lesson from Pat Martino before he died because he's the guy that lost his memory and then relearned.

Chris: 6:23

The's right, that's right, yeah yeah, I mean I was doing a show in in, uh, reading, no, not really. Where was it? Philadelphia, and he lives in Philly, uh. So a friend of mine suggested that I do it because he'd done it and he said it was a great thing. So, and I was a massive Pat Martino fan, so I just to him and I said, look, I'm coming over to do a show, can I get a lesson from you? He said, fine, great, yeah, I flew to Philly, didn't sleep a wink that night, just so excited and like anxious about you know, meeting up on time and all that.

Announcement: 6:59

Yeah, exactly.

Chris: 7:00

And then I went to his house and you know I knew what he was going to teach me, so the teaching aspect was not even interesting to me, you know. I mean, he told me what to play on a altered chord or something and I thought, yeah, that's kind of interesting, but I just kind of know it, you know, yeah, but what I got from pat was fascinating to me because it was the permission to dedicate my entire life to the jazz guitar.

Announcement: 7:25

Do you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.

Chris: 7:27

From a zen kind of philosophical approach, because I had spent many, many years doubting myself as a jazz musician, because I'd grown up here and it was a little bit taboo to kind of call yourself a jazz guitar player, because you had to work, so you had to be able to play in all styles and go out on the road and take tours and things like that. And if everybody knew that you were a jazz guy they kind of shunned you a bit, didn't they? You know what I mean? Yeah, so everybody was very careful not to kind of overextend themselves in that department, and and that never left me even when I moved to la. So it wasn't until I went and just hung out with Pat that I thought this is who he is. He lives and breathes the jazz guitar. Why can't I do that? And the minute that I left his lesson I threw away my strats. You know, I threw them in the cupboard, you know what I mean.

Chris: 8:21

And then I dedicated myself to this archtop jazz guitar. I thought I'm going to be that guy. I'm going to own it, 100% it was unbelievable Fantastic. Yeah.

Geoff: 8:29

So you're known as a smooth jazz guitarist, right? I hate that word.

Chris: 8:33

Yeah, I was going to say that I hate it too. Yeah, because it's really funny that I asked somebody as soon as I moved there. I said how long is it going to take for me to get anywhere? These are about 10 years, and they were right on the money so hold on 10 years.

Geoff: 8:59

That's what. That's what it would take in in London, though, wasn't it?

Chris: 9:01

yeah, yeah yeah, but you were LA , so I was 20 years broke, put it that way.

Chris: 9:05

At least it was sunny, so there's a guitar player you might have heard of called Mark Antoine. He is a french nylon string guitar player and we were friends hanging out LA . I mean, I didn't even know he was much of a musician, we just were in a friendly circle, we lived locally and we had some friends in common and we'd all get together on saturday night, eat pizza and watch a movie. I had no idea that he was a serious musician. I thought I knew he played the guitar, but it just didn't come up. Do you know what I mean? And one day he said Chris, I've, I've got a record deal with this little label in new york with Mike Mainieri. It's his label. Do you want to hear some stuff?

Chris: 9:46

So I went into his little bedroom and he put a little cassette player on. He played with this stuff and I was absolutely knocked out. I thought who else is doing this? At the time it was very forward thinking. Yeah, so I. I was. I was knocked out. And then a couple of weeks later he said look, I've got, I've got a hit song on the radio. Do you want to come and strum for me on some gigs? Oh, nice. So I was doing nothing.

Chris: 10:09

You know, I was literally just you know his music is very simple, it's like E, minor, g, D. You know Certainly was at the time and I just thought what am I doing? I can make some money. You know it's great.

Chris: 10:19

So I ended up in Mark's band and he got me on a big tour and I met Rick Braun, Kirk Whalum, Peter White and of course Mark and I was in the band backing them all. So I met all these guys. I ended up working for Rick and then Richard Elliott, so I got really ensconced into that smooth world by chance, it was just luck of the draw. And then, right after that tour, I got signed to a label in new york called instinct records and I did my first two records with them and I invited Kirk Whalum, I invited Rick to play on the records with me and it helped propel my career a little bit. And I was off to the races and then, before you know it, my phone stopped ringing completely and I became an artist and I and it was a kick up the backside because I thought I've got to make a living now and You've got to start hustling for yourself. Oh yeah, so that was the turning point.

Geoff: 11:10

Wow, fantastic. So in terms of improvising, what's that? How did you learn your? Where did you get your vocabulary from?

Chris: 11:30

would you say. That's a really good question. Where did I get my? Well, I mean, I listened to different players from different stages of my life, you know. So back in the the day I was listening to a guy called Jan Ackerman who was a guitar player from focus and he had a very classical guitar approach, but with chops, you know. So you'd play kind of uh, scalically and yeah and that's kind of jazz fusion, isn't it?

Chris: 11:54

it was kind of jazz fusion, but it was not considered jazz because it wasn't coming from a jazz vocabulary but it was coming from a technical vocabulary, you know, so that I under I could hear that and I understood it. You know, and you knew what that was. And then I listened to Jeff Beck and of course his harmonic vocabulary is very simple but with a beautiful feel very expressive very, very expressive, which really spoke to me.

Chris: 12:17

So I got into Jeff Beck for a long time, but again no, no real jazz vocabulary happening yet. And then I got into Larry Carlton, once again all feel and technique, but not a massive jazz vocabulary, but really spoke to me. You know what I? So I had a kind of a pop fusion crossover calling you know what I mean listening to that.

Chris: 12:39

And then I got into Pat Metheny in a massive way in the late 80s. There was an album called Off Ramp. It just totally changed my life. It was so expressive, it was the bridging point into jazz for me and of course I went to music college. I met all these guys who played in NYJO and I got into NYJO and all of a sudden I'm having to start playing flat nine chords and sharp five, and you know so I'm slowly but surely getting a, getting a harmonic vocabulary did you transcribe?

Geoff: 13:10

did you actually write down?

Chris: 13:11

I I did a little bit of transcription from people like Scott Henderson and Robin Ford, people I could understand what they were doing and spoke to me. Much later I got into transcribing Pat Martino and things like that. But also I got the Charlie Parker Omnibook which was my bible for years and years and years and that taught me bebop basically. So I became a jazz guy with that kind of vocabulary, but it was. But it was my pop fusion background that stayed, because I I like the two and four thing for whatever reason.

Chris: 13:45

Yeah, I like the feel good soul aspect, but I was always really interested in in harmony. So once I got into Pat Metheny and Pat Martino and Charlie Parker, I was kind of off to the race a little bit. Look, thinking upper structure more. You know what I mean, yeah, yeah, and more recently it's been more of a question of listening to all these crazy guitar players who play like crazy arpeggios and yeah, uh, and I've introduced a bit more of that into my playing. So there's a bit more of a balance between it all you know, and that's now.

Geoff: 14:14

It's just who I am now you know. Fantastic, yeah, and the and the, the soul thing comes into it, doesn't it as well with the smooth jazz, it's a got a very heavy soul element to it. Are you into soul music and how does that?

Chris: 14:25

well, I think I'm into it in America there has been an R&B phenomenon for years and years and years and it just it's in the blood of everybody. It's so ingrained. And that's one thing I learned when I got there, just that the the whole ; thing that doesn't exist here. I mean I was don't know about you, but when I grew up I was listening to progressive rock, you know. Yeah, but as soon as I went over there I was meeting all these people who were listening to cameo and parliament and funkadelic and all the motown stuff, you know. And then James Brown. I mean I was aware of James Brown but I didn't understand it. You know what? I mean it was the basis to people like Prince, you know and Bruno Mars.

Chris: 15:04

And it all got tied together when I moved over there. You know, in a way that it would not have done. I mean, I remember another thing that happened to me when I got over there. I would hang out at this jam session on a monday night and tons of guitar players were there and I met a lot of people and one guy said to me chris, you know, you've got to get some blues into your playing.

Chris: 15:24

You know, I had been here into Alan Holsworth and Scott Henderson and it wasn't a blues based music you know yeah and as soon as I went there with the R&B thing, listening to people like George Benson and Robin Ford, it was all rooted on the tonic, you know, and that was really interesting to me too and it was a kick up the back s though I've got no blues in me, what, what, and they were absolutely right. I literally studied the blues scale in all positions, isn't that?

Geoff: 15:54

isn't that the first thing we guitar players learn? Yes, of course yeah, but it.

Chris: 15:57

But once I learned it I kind of discarded it. Yeah I wanted to get into more adventurous territory.

Geoff: 16:02

You know it's great that you've been in in la all that time and you still sound english yeah, right, yeah, I know it's rude so when you go into a sandwich shop, do you ask for a tomato?

Chris: 16:12

I do yeah that's great.

Geoff: 16:13

Yeah, I mean people understand you.

Chris: 16:16

I've got a friend out there who has been there a long time and I said to him, because he's English, and I said at what point in your career in LA did you literally decide to say tomato instead of tomato? Because it's a big shift, isn't it? Yeah, I mean, it was it 10 years, 12 years at 5, uh-huh, because at some point you've got to say I'm doing that now. Yeah, do you know what I mean? Yeah, and I haven't.

Geoff: 16:37

I've never done you never done it I love that about you. That's brilliant. Yeah, yeah, okay. So what about practicing?

Chris: 16:53

what about it? Do you?

Geoff: 16:56

do it do, I do it do you do, practice, do it.

Chris: 16:58

Do you do practicing? I go through fits and starts of practice, although I'm always working on time. You know like time feel and making things. You know, as a guitar player, we have a terrible tendency to rush a little bit. Years, you know, I struggled getting on stage and going. Why is this? Why? Why is this not feeling good? And so time is always an ongoing thing to to calm, and I do feel like in the last couple of years, uh, I'm kind of finally getting it and sitting it in a pocket but I know you're very hands-on with your studio.

Geoff: 17:33

You produce your own records yeah you yeah, all that, don't you? So, yeah, um, there must be an element of um time, because you're constantly working with metronomes and clicks and so on but I also think it's.

Chris: 17:43

For me, it's been a question of learning how to relax right rather than going oh I gotta say this, or you know, I just I want to be that guy, you know, and that's maturity, isn't it? Yeah of course it's about letting the music come to you rather than chasing the music you know. So that's, that's one thing that never goes away. The time thing, and the other thing is I'm always.

Chris: 18:08

I'm always looking for new vocabulary in some kind of way to to approach playing over changes, you know and uh, and I found these these are arpeggio things that I'm now concentrating on a little bit and and inversions across the fretboard. You know, that's really, really helped, and it's all helped with my time as well. For, for whatever reason, you know that and of course I, you know, once in a while I'll grab a classical guitar piece and I'll just spend weeks just shedding and shedding it and spend weeks just shedding it and shedding it, and then I'll record it and video it and then never play it again.

Geoff: 18:42

How many albums have you made now?

Chris: 18:43

It's probably up to 20, or close to it 18, 19, 20.

Geoff: 18:48

Fantastic, so you've obviously got a very good work ethic.

Chris: 18:51

I'm able to structure my day that I can get lots of things done. I'm really good at checklists and things like that, and I structure my day that I can get lots of things done. I'm really good at checklists and things like that, and I structure my day that in the morning I take care of business and in the afternoon it's all creative time and so if I'm gonna, you know, write or arrange or compose, that's my time to do it. You know, and I'm done by like five. In the afternoon I'm spending time with my wife or going for a run or, yeah, cooking dinner.

Geoff: 19:15

You know me so you got, you got married last year, yeah, yeah but you also had a heart attack, didn't I did? Yeah, was that all last year that?

Chris: 19:24

no, that was. It was like four years ago, that's. It was it right, okay yeah.

Geoff: 19:29

Yeah, how's marriage.

Chris: 19:30

Oh, it's fantastic. Yeah, I mean, it's never without its little hiccup, is it, Geoff? But we're solid, we're really compatible. We're so similar. It's hilarious, that's brilliant. And she's a lot younger than me, so she's going to take care of me when I'm old. Great. Poor thing, so I've made some apps yes, you have, and and mighty fine they are too. Thank you, Chris, thank you.

Geoff: 20:04

Quartet one through four are the jazz standards play-alongs now so and they're used by a lot of people for teaching and for practicing. I asked you what standard you'd like to play. What did you decide?

Chris: 20:16

Well, I've always liked Stella by Starlight. I mean there's a bunch that I like, but that was one of the first ones I really got my teeth into back in the day. I have to say I don't play standards too often these days just because I'm doing my own music, you know, and it calls for so much work on that. But I love playing standards and of course we've recorded a standards record together anyway, with the strings, yeah, which is beautiful.

Geoff: 20:42

What I'm going to do? I'm going to put the app on. Stick your headphones on, yeah, um, and make me play some notes. And you're going to play, I believe, two choruses, am I o of St ella by Starlight. Okay, and um, it's going to be great. And then I shall be judged. No, you won't be judged, really.

Chris: 20:58

No, we're not playing the tune. Hey, listen, I'll be judging myself.

Geoff: 21:02

That's for Stella. Let me just give you a sound check. Probably going to be loud enough, isn't it the mic? It's picking up from that mic. That's all Right. So your introduction is the last eight the piano, bass and drums. I could take the piano off if you prefer or you could do one without. Yeah, that's fine. All right, here we go.

Geoff: 21:40

Music. Do um, do, do. Thank you, do do, wow. Brilliant, was it alright? It was great. Yeah, how was it for you? That's alright. Yeah, could do another five choruses to get in there. Yeah, I think that's a good thing. Yeah, I think that's a good thing. Yeah, I think that's a good thing. Yeah, I think that's a good thing.

Geoff: 23:18

Yeah, I think that's a good thing. Yeah, I think, wow, brilliant, was it alright? That was great. Yeah, how was it for you that's?

Chris: 23:32

alright, could do another five choruses to get in there.

Geoff: 23:38

That's a hard tune, isn't it, Stella? It's an unusual tune, isn't it?

Chris: 23:42

Yeah, but the great thing about that song is like I mean, all the solutions are in there. Do you know what I mean? Every type of chord that you want to ever study is in that song. That's a good point.

Geoff: 23:56

Yeah, you know what I mean. But the way it starts we're in the key of B flat, aren't we?

Announcement: 24:01

But the first chord is E minor 7 flat 5.

Chris: 24:03

Yeah.

Geoff: 24:04

Where does that come from? It's nuts, isn't it?

Chris: 24:07

It's the most bizarre composition, isn't it? And it doesn't really make any kind of songwriting sense in a traditional form does it, no, but it's become a standard. I mean, it's fabulous, isn't?

Geoff: 24:23

it. What's great about that is that in the last eight, where it goes down, those minor 2-5-1s- isn't it which is so bizarre?

Chris: 24:30

Whoever would write that. You know what I mean.

Geoff: 24:32

But of course you, you know these aren't the original chords, are they? Have you heard the original version of it?

Chris: 24:36

it's a I have heard the original.

Geoff: 24:38

It's not far away, though it's a lot less chords, for example oh is it. The first chord is is like a diminished chord for two bars yeah it's um. It's a beautiful thing yeah, the original.

Chris: 24:50

It's been a while I have but I have to check that. But it's been a long time.

Geoff: 24:53

Are there any any sort of particular corners in that that you have to had to work on or you find difficult?

Chris: 25:00

Yeah, I mean the bridge section when it goes to G7. Sharp 5 is always Something you got to think about, because I've always really been into step wise resolution, so any melodies just like resolving by step. I have this thing about playing, where if I play a phrase, I generally start my next phrase a step away from where I left off.

Geoff: 25:27

OK.

Chris: 25:28

So you'll never really hear me do big jumps for the most part.

Geoff: 25:32

Is that adding a dominant chord in front of the chord, do you mean? Is that? Is that what?

Chris: 25:35

you mean no, no, no, for instance, just okay. So let's just assume I'm playing something in C minor and I go Okay. My next phrase would be what I'm not going to do is be what I'm not going to do is.

Chris: 25:59

I'm not doing that because I want my train of thought to be stepwise and and melodic. So to get to your original question, when you go to that G7 sharp five, you gotta think, well, how am I gonna make this melodic when you've you've got a limited amount of note choices? If you want to say something melodic, so stuff like this, I mean you can do that, all that whole tone thing, but how do you stay melodic?

Geoff: 26:22

It's an unusual chord. It's a dominant chord with a sharp five.

Chris: 26:26

To stay on that chord for two bars is tough. Usually it's a five chord and you just resolve it. It's fine.

Geoff: 26:32

Here's a question Do you find it easier to play on changes or easier to play on one chord?

Chris: 26:38

With this type of guitar when you're playing clean, give me changes, changes, yeah. The thing is if you're playing with a distorted sound, you can get away with a lot more because you can sustain things and you can just sit on notes and you know, and and you can move around. But with the jazz guitar you can't, because the note goes dead. So you've actually got to keep moving, you've got to have some forward.

Geoff: 27:01

Momentum. Jazz guitars traditionally have very heavy strings, yeah, but that's where you can't get the sustain, isn't it? I mean, if you're playing really light strings, you can hold them and bend them and so on, but it's also a function of the arch top guitar.

Chris: 27:14

I mean it requires heavier strings, you know, and the notes go dead once you hit it, you know. I mean you just have a certain amount of time. I like changes. I mean I've always enjoyed them, because there's something about chord movement that enables you to kind of say less, in a way, because the chords are dictating.

Geoff: 27:34

I'm exactly the same as you Do you know what I mean.

Announcement: 27:36

Yeah totally.

Geoff: 27:37

I find it harder to play on a modal piece than I do on changes, but maybe it's got something to do with growing up with bebop, I suppose it's always a challenge to navigate through. It's like a path you find, isn't it?

Chris: 27:51

I remember when I used to do little jam sessions and show up and they would call so what and? Yeah, you know, and it's sort of modal thing terrifying and I would go. Well, I mean I can do it. You know how interesting does this really sound? You know, yeah, I mean george benson, for instance, you know he would rip through it and and it would sound incredible. Yeah, but it's, it's. It's a rare thing to be able to do that on a jazz guitar.

Geoff: 28:13

I wanted to ask you about composing as well. You write a lot don't you. I do. Do you compose with specific projects in mind, or do you get an idea any time of the day and you just write?

Chris: 28:22

Definitely not that guy. I have to have somebody to write for. I'm a bit lazy about that. I mean, I've always got a record to write for, but generally, once I've finished the record, I'm not doing anything for six months. You know, however, I have been signing artists to my label, and so I need to write for them but uh generally, if I've got a record that I'm working on, like I am right now actually tell us what you're working on at the moment.

Chris: 28:45

Well, it's a new album and it's got kind of an old quincy j thing about it. Lots of nice lush chord changes and strings and horns. I just want to encapsulate the whole spectrum of arranging on this one.

Geoff: 28:58

Brilliant, because I know you've just done some concerts with horns as well, haven't you?

Chris: 29:02

We did yeah, and I'm really into it. I'm hoping we can do that over here at some point too.

Geoff: 29:08

It'd be great to do the strings thing again't it? Oh, I'd love it, Geoff, I tell you, I mean, it's my favorite thing for everyone who doesn't know we made an album a few years ago, which? What was?

Geoff: 29:16

the name of the album. Wonderful, Wonderful World.

Geoff: 29:18

Yeah and uh and Chris and the trio recorded the trio LA yeah, you had you had Peter Erskine and got guys really great.

Chris: 29:26

Yeah, a whole bunch of stars Randy Brecker, yeah, Harvey Mason, Chuck Berghofer and and a few local guys, you know. Yeah, but it was really really nice and this was.

Geoff: 29:37

This was not pretty much in the lockdown, really, wasn't that this happened?

Chris: 29:41

yeah, it gave me something to do for a couple of years at home, which was fantastic, you know, but it also meant that I couldn't come to your Abbey Road session, which was gut-wrenching. Yeah, because I'd never been and this is my opportunity. I mean, I was there on Zoom in perfect hands, of course. I was there with my baton in Studio 2.

Geoff: 30:01

It was an amazing thrill yeah.

Geoff: 30:03

With all the strings.

Geoff: 30:04

Usually strings sit two to a music stand, but they couldn't because of lockdown so everyone had their own music stand. Right which stand, but they couldn't because of lockdown. Yeah, they each everyone had their own music stand right, which, of course, meant they're more productive because they can't matter about their kids. You know that's hilarious, yeah.

Chris: 30:17

Yeah, we finished way early yeah, well, I I remember just a few weeks ago I was recording for my last album and I booked this horn section like just the best horn section you could possibly book in. La, I'd arranged all the horns, everything was completely arranged to the letter. I think they had like six tracks to do and they were done in 20 minutes. What are you

Chris: 30:41

guys on.

Chris: 30:42

I had nothing to say. It was so incredible.

Geoff: 30:51

I've got some questions to finish off. Oh, let's do it, let's do it, you've got a favourite album.

Chris: 30:56

Of all time. Yeah, I don't know why The Visit by Pat Martino comes to mind instantly.

Geoff: 31:03

That's good. The first reaction is yeah, but I'm not sure it's actually my all-time favourite album. It's a difficult question, but it's the one that comes to mind oh, it's so difficult.

Chris: 31:10

Yeah, all-time favorite album, but it's the one that comes to mind. It's oh, it's so difficult, yeah, yeah, I mean, that's as good as anything you know, I mean just this version of what you do in the rest of your life is oh I don't think I've heard that you gotta hear it. You gotta hear it wow, it's insane.

Geoff: 31:21

The next question, kind of you may well say the same thing, but is there a favorite musician, alive or dead, you'd like to play with?

Chris: 31:30

god, that's a good question. Who do I want to play with? You know it's so funny some I've been asked this question before and I I don't know the answer. I have no interest between you and me and this podcast in collaborating with most smooth guys.

Chris: 31:48

I don't really associate myself with that kind of music as a general thing, although as the market I'm in and of course they're all my friends and I'm happy to play with them yeah, but I you know, when I call somebody's a guest with me, it tends to be somebody who is more of a kind of a crossover kind of a guy you know, yeah, if you could book a band and you only had to have a star bass player or a star drummer or a star keyboard player or a sax player.

Geoff: 32:14

What would you spend the money on? What's more important?

Chris: 32:16

I would need the drummer to be right. Okay, it's all about the drums, yeah, yeah, and and it's. It's not about just booking a great play. It's, stylistically, finding the guy who understands what this music is. Um, and a lot of people don't. When it's right, it's fantastic.

Geoff: 32:33

Has there been a highlight of your career or best gig moment?

Chris: 32:36

Yes, and I think in all honesty it was that Live in London album. A few years ago at Cadogan Hall over here, we had a 12-piece string section and a rhythm section and there was like 48 people involved in making this happen. The whole thing was videoed live multi-camera. It was recorded, you know, to be a live album.

Chris: 33:01

And Geoff, talk about scary it was actually my, a business guy over here, man who books all my shows in in London. He said you know, I think we should do a Live in London album and and, but we want to video it and record it and then put it out. And I thought, one night, over one night, and that's the record and that's the scariest thing. So the the only way that I figured I could do this was to book a tour of like eight shows and make sure that was the final night. So that's what we did. We did eight shows and by the final night the band was on and I was warmed up and we just all stepped up to the plate and actually it sounded really good. It was a kind of a. It was a tough one to mix because of the acoustics.

Announcement: 33:46

It's kind of boomy in that room yeah, and separating the strings.

Chris: 33:49

Of course that was not straightforward, yeah, but we we came up pretty good. You know, I don't think I'd ever do it again. It was so scary.

Geoff: 33:59

But yeah, real high point. What was the last concert you attended?

Chris: 34:02

the last concert I attended the one that comes to mind was my wife and I went up to San Francisco to go and see Earth, Wind and Fire and Lonel Richie and I and see Earth, Wind, Fire and Lionel Richie. Now I've got some friends who are playing in Lionel's band. I'm not a big Lionel Richie fan, although Eric and my wife loves him.

Geoff: 34:19

I love Lionel Richie.

Chris: 34:20

So anyway, I went to go and see Earth Wind Fire, right. And we get there and we're meeting my wife's mother in a hotel and things got waylaid and the traffic's horrendous and we couldn't park. By the time we got in we missed the whole Earth Wind Fire concert we came. We came for the last song and they were playing In the Stone.

Geoff: 34:40

Oh, and then that was it, and then it was line of Richie. How was Lionel, though?

Chris: 34:46

great, I mean the power's great you know, but it's I mean he puts on a great show you know what I mean and great songs you can't deny him. But I went to see Earth, Wind and Fire and you missed them.

Geoff: 34:55

I missed them Jesus *** oh what are you thinking um what would you say was your musical weakness?

Chris: 35:04

oh, I know exactly what my musical weakness is polyrhythms, I, I the whole polyrhythmic thing is. It's not something I've seriously worked on. Okay, I mean, you know, I can do like fives and sevens, you're talking about playing three over four. Yeah. I mean I can do fives and sevens. I just If I get too out with myself. It's like I've got to listen to the drums, you know.

Chris: 35:28

And it's not, it's a. It's a bit of a crutch for me and, if I'm really honest, it's something that, um, you know, like the amazing guitar players I know of all coming out of New York, they don't need babysitting from a drummer. Do you know what I'm talking?

Geoff: 35:44

about their internal time is so strong.

Chris: 35:49

They can. They can be messing around with the time. There's a couple of guys in LA who can do it and I just never understand how they do it. But they're so strong and they know where the time is at every turn and I'm kind of envious of that. But that's definitely a world they live in.

Geoff: 36:06

Are you listening to any of that sort of stuff? Is that any part of your?

Chris: 36:12

thing? From time to time. I do because I listen to those guys. There's a few New York guys that I really, really like. I'm not really interested to be that kind of a guy and feel like I should be studying it more. Once in a while I delve into it. But you asked me what my weakness is and it's that and the reason is it's my fault.

Geoff: 36:32

You know it's like that will comes back to time, doesn't it? And playing well in time, I suppose it's all part of time.

Chris: 36:38

But, it's all. It's all to do with what you study and what you focus on, and I've always focused on vocabulary and time, you know and that would be, I suppose, groups and arpeggios in groups of five and those, that's what you're talking about, absolutely yeah, and and learning phrases that go across the bar and things like that and knowing how much time you've got left in a bar, but it's got to come second nature and it so.

Chris: 37:04

It takes a lot of work and it's not something I've spent enough time on there's not much of that in the smooth jazz which is why I haven't spent as much time as I need to. But that's not saying that I couldn't incorporate it.

Geoff: 37:17

I've certainly noticed in your music there's a lot more changes than some of the other artists you're associated with.

Chris: 37:22

And everybody tells me that yeah, which is great from my perspective, playing your music. Well, I've always been into harmony, yeah, that.

Geoff: 37:33

I'm. I've always been into harmony. Yeah, that's great, it doesn't go unnoticed. No, well, that's nice. You'd be probably answer this already, but I was gonna ask is you ever get nervous on stage?

Chris: 37:41

you know I I don't really get nervous on stage. If I knew that George Benson was gonna be in the audience, or any of my heroes, you know, or any really, really, really respected person that I looked up to, I would probably freak out a little bit. I might do, I don't think I would lose it, but I think I would be in my head just a little bit and I'd have to figure out a way to get out of my head.

Geoff: 38:07

It adds a little edge, doesn't?

Chris: 38:08

it. It adds an edge. I know exactly that feeling.

Geoff: 38:10

Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, I was fine with that. It adds a good edge though.

Chris: 38:13

Can do, but I do know that in order for me to really get in that zen state, you've just got to get out of your own way.

Geoff: 38:20

Forget it all. Yeah, Do you have a favourite sandwich?

Chris: 38:25

I do, yeah, and it is. I'm particularly fond of a turkey and swiss and pesto sandwich. Ooh yeah, that's very LA, isn't it? It is, yeah, yeah, well, I make them. You see, I'm a very good sandwich maker.

Geoff: 38:40

Excellent, yeah, swiss, the fact that you say Swiss, swiss cheese Is a Swiss.

Chris: 38:44

Is fact that you say Swiss, swiss cheese?

Geoff: 38:45

Yeah, yeah yeah, don't say that over here, really.

Chris: 38:47

What do they say? Cheese, Just cheese. Anchovies I like my anchovies, oh fishy.

Geoff: 38:56

Fishy, fishy Ooh. What about a favourite movie?

Chris: 39:00

The one that comes to mind is the Shawshank Redemption. Oh yeah, of course.

Geoff: 39:04

I mean it's the classic movie the feeling of when he finally spoiler alert when he finally gets out. Yeah, you know that relief after everything he's gone through in that movie and he finally gets out. Yeah, and it's just like the most brilliant thing, isn't it, it's so satisfying, satisfying. And I watched it. I showed it to my kids for the first time and I sat them down and I said you're going to watch one of the best films ever made yeah and they sat there with their mouths open and they didn't speak the whole time.

Geoff: 39:36

Yeah, they were young, you know. Yeah, but it's funny watching it the second time. It's one of those films that, yeah, it's brilliant, but you can't really watch it again because you know what's going to happen well, you know, I I watched it again about 15 years later, right, and I forgot what happened.

Chris: 39:53

So I loved it just as much yeah, now I'm not sure I should watch it again.

Geoff: 39:57

Yeah well, certainly for another 15 years. He gets out in the end does he yeah?

Chris: 40:02

he does that's nice to hear um?

Geoff: 40:05

is there a favorite venue you like to play in? A?

Chris: 40:08

favourite venue. Well, I'm particularly fond of playing venues where the sound is really good. We're sitting here at the Pizza Express in Hoburn and the sound is really good in here, so I do enjoy playing at this venue. But there's a few venues in the States that I love to play at. There's place in Denver I used to play every year, called Soiled Dove Underground, which is the most beautiful venue, I mean it sounds named.

Chris: 40:31

Terrible name. Yeah, what is the soil? But so is the Pizza Express, if you think about it. But the Soiled Dove, I mean, I know, yeah, but my god, it was a great stage. The sound system system was immaculate. I play at this venue called Spaghettini in Seal Beach four times a year and the sound system is as good as anywhere I've ever played.

Geoff: 40:53

And you obviously travel a lot. Have you got a favourite country or city to visit or spend time in?

Chris: 40:58

I'm not really into travelling much at all, to be honest with you anymore. I'm just as happy not to leave the house. It's nice to come home. I often struggle with the jet lag so that doesn't make it fun, but this trip has been kind of a breeze so far. So, when that's doable. I love coming here and you see your family when you come back here.

Geoff: 41:19

One last question what's your favourite chord?

Chris: 41:22

Okay, so I've got this theory. In pop music, a lot of of melodies, a lot of hook melodies, focus on the third degree of the scale and the fourth degree of the scale, and I mean you can listen to a lot of pop songs and you'll find when it gets, it gets to the chorus, those are the notes that they hit. Yep. So I figured out, why not play the third and the fourth together? At the best of both worlds okay, so I just love chords like this just tell us what those notes are.

Geoff: 41:54

That's what those notes are okay.

Chris: 41:57

So, uh, let's say I'm playing an, a major. I'm thinking of either a major seven or f, sharp minor nine. Yeah, so the notes would be e, g, sharp a.

Geoff: 42:12

So it's that it's something that sounds particularly good on the guitar, isn't it, you know? And you add a fifth on the top.

Chris: 42:19

Yeah, you know, and that works for F sharp minor and A. That's lovely.

Announcement: 42:26

Yeah, I love that yeah.

Chris: 42:27

So that's my favourite chord right there, lovely.

Geoff: 42:31

Well, Chris, thank you so much for your time. You're welcome, mate, it's been great and I'm looking forward to playing again tonight. Yeah, can't wait and I'm sorry about the noise in the background. There's a few plunks and things.

Chris: 42:41

It's time for us to stop, isn't it?

Geoff: 42:42

I think it's time for us to stop. I need to set the tables up. I'll see you soon. Sounds good mate, all right, bye, see you.

Announcement: 42:48

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