Geoff: 0:01

Hello podcats, Geoff Gascoyne here, hope you're well. It's another beautiful spring day and I'm in West London, I'm in Acton. I'm going to see a wonderful young alto player. Her name is Camilla George. I've only ever worked with her once before, but she's doing some really good things for British jazz. I'm looking forward to meeting her and talking about her roots, talking about practising, talking about sitting in with famous jazz musicians. So here we go.

Announcement: 0:44

The Quartet Jazz Standards podcast is brought to you by the Quartet app for iOS, taking your jazz play along to another level.

Geoff: 0:54

Hello, it's Geoff.

Camilla: 0:55

Hello, it's the top floor, my friend.

Geoff: 0:58

OK, come out. Thanks. There's my exercise for the day. How are you?

Geoff: 1:11

I'm good, thanks nice to see you thanks for having me around. It's all right. Oh god, this is my uh, I call it the pinnacle so how are you today? I'm good thanks.

Geoff: 1:24

Yeah, it's a lovely day, isn't it in Acton?

Camilla: 1:26

a it's wicked. Yeah, it's always sunny in acting, is it? Is that right? No?

Geoff: 1:32

Can we start by talking about how you got started into improvising and a little bit about your background?

Camilla: 1:37

I got into jazz from my dad. My dad was a massive jazz fan, um, and he had a big vinyl collection and every Sunday I used to sit with him and we'd listen to all his favorites.

Camilla: 1:50

Um, I've got some of it here Stanley Turrentine, Sunny Steer, and that's how I got into kind of listening to improvised music. And, um, when I was 11, that's when I started playing saxophone and I discovered, um, Tomorrow's Warriors. My mom had taken me to see Jazz Jamaica yeah, Denys Baptiste was playing and I remember kind of going up to him being like I've just got a sax I'm gonna be just like you um, hugely presumptuous on my part, but that's how I started getting into the music.

Camilla: 2:25

And then my parents used to take me to loads of concerts. I went with my dad to see Sonny Rollins quite a few times actually.

Geoff: 2:32

I guess he would be walking out into the audience right, and Sonny used to do that didn't he?

Camilla: 2:36

He did. Well, the last time I saw him, he was obviously quite old. I think that might be one of the last concerts that he did. But quite old, I think that might be one of the last concerts that he did. But yeah, when I was younger he was definitely a performer, right, right.

Geoff: 2:49

Were you born in West London? Are you from this e undefined?

Camilla: 2:50

a I've lived in West London for the majority of my life, but I was actually born in Nigeria and then we came over here. Well, actually we had to because my dad got deported. We couldn't stay because my dad's grenadian Grenadian and we came and the first place that we stayed in london London halsden, Harlesden which was okay, but we moved progressively further west.

Geoff: 3:19

Yeah, was there any influence of African music early on? Was there any influence of?

Camilla: 3:23

African music early on, Definitely, my parents listened to a lot of Fela, King Sunny Ade. I mean, my parents saw Fela at the Shrine in Nigeria, which is like so cool.

Geoff: 3:35

Famous In the 70s. Yeah, very cool. Fela Kuti yes, do you find that's kind of in your music you're making at the moment?

Camilla: 3:42

Yeah, definitely, I'm definitely influenced in the sounds and the um. I guess the stories behind where I was born. I went back a few times so I was born in a place called Eket in what is now Akwa Ibom state and actually there is a big band now um the BBO Sounds Project, but nobody else was from that. Every other Nigerian I met was kind of like Yoruba or Hausa or whatever. But yes, the BBO culture is something that has influenced my writing massively. What's what's the sort of um significance of that music, would you say?

Camilla: 4:20

I think it's more the significance of the people in the community. So my my last album, Ibbio Ibbio, that was dedicated to the BBO people and Ibbio Ibbio is like their nickname. It technically means short, but it doesn't mean that everyone's short. It's like their quick, quick way of doing things. They don't mess about and they don't faff around, and all of the tunes in there were kind of about our creation myths and the things that really important to the society. So, um, the god Abassi and his wife, atai ekpe, which is a secret society, which it's really, it's a religious group, but they govern the law and order, so kind of like like a local policeman as well right, um, and there were a whole load of things.

Camilla: 5:06

There's a shrine in the village um, the Juju Shrine, which I wrote about. I've always been someone that has been influenced in my writing by stories, and the thing that I've always been fascinated about is the people that I was born into and grew up with.

Camilla: 5:23

I think, do you write lyrics too? No, um, there's something I want to get into, but it is something that it's not. As an instrumentalist, you know, you can't just be like oh yeah, now I'm gonna write some lyrics, because this, when I've had a go, they haven't been very good, it's hard isn't it?

Geoff: 5:38

yeah, it's really hard. I know you say you're inspired by people, but how would that translate into actual musical terms if you would have to say that was this certain riffy things or chord sequences, or how could you put that into words?

Camilla: 5:51

Well, there's one tune on my second album which is based on a book of African folk tales which my mom used to read to me and I've actually got it on the bookshelf and the book is called The People Could Fly and it's got all these tales of animals in them and when I was younger I thought that's just about animals, but actually it's about the animals take on the roles of the slaves and the slave owners. So it's actually is very deep. This book and one of the tunes is about a turtle tapping the land turtle and one of the tunes I wrote on the album and it's based on this story there's a famine. The turtle goes to see the underlord and he gives him a stick and he says if you tap that three times, food will appear, but you can't tap it more than that. So in the tune that I wrote I've got this riff which comes three times.

Camilla: 6:42

People always like get a bit caught out on because they expect it to be twice and then it's three times and that's the whole thing of that. Trying to mirror bits of the story in the way I've written it. Yeah, that's fantastic.

Geoff: 6:55

When you were developing as a soloist, as an improviser? How did you get your vocabulary? Did you transcribe things? Where do you think your vocabulary came from? Your improvising vocabulary?

Camilla: 7:07

Definitely transcriptions. I mean, I had Jean Toussaint as a teacher from quite an early age. I think I must have been 13, actually, when I first 13, 14, when I first went for lessons with him. He was very scary at the time and his big thing was transcriptions. And that's how I got into that. It's kind of a magic thing, isn't it?

Geoff: 7:28

if you transcribe, you suddenly get better well, not suddenly, but you definitely get better. Yeah, it does take a little bit, if it was that easy.

Camilla: 7:38

It's not a magic trick, but there's this thing of that deep listening that it seeps in. Obviously, if you just transcribe and you don't analyze it, then there's limits as to how yeah, how far, but that's definitely something I, I love to do. Are are there um particular solos that you could cite as being a sort of a formative thing for you?

Camilla: 7:59

Um, when I first started transcribing, I went to Dexter because that was a way of hearing the Bebop language in a clearer way for me than, say, going straight to Parker, because yeah, I think the thing with Parker is it's not just the language, it's phrasing.

Camilla: 8:16

That's quite. Sometimes when you analyze it it's quite odd. I mean, I did for my dissertation, which I don't think they very much enjoyed, but I was looking at the kind of influence of the clave rhythm on West African clave, on some of Parker's phrasing, because I find it quite odd. I think that's something that's quite distinct. But anyways, that didn't go anywhere. No, but the clave appears in every kind of western music, doesn't it? It's everywhere.

Geoff: 8:39

That's quite distinct, but anyways, that didn't go anywhere. Yeah, but no, but the clave appears in every kind of western music, doesn't it? It's everywhere, it's everywhere.

Camilla: 8:46

Um, there's something particular with his, with the, with his phrasing. So I started with Dexter loads of those classic um. You know, Our Man in Paris was one album. I just was like, right, I'm gonna do the whole album. Sonny Stitt um, I remember Sunny Side of the Street being that raffle. I've got to get go get the whole thing down. Um and um. Vincent Herring became um was a obsession of mine for quite, quite some time and then I discovered my absolute kind of um idol, Kenny Garrett, and I started getting into that and that Kenny's great because he's got such a vast kind of catalog. I found um early recordings of him, you know, just playing playing standards, but he's really young, and then you've got all the different stages of his playing career. Yeah, and there's something to be taken from all of them, I think, especially as an alto player yeah, yeah. Did you always just play alto?

Geoff: 9:41

Did you play tenor before that?

Camilla: 9:43

I dabbled for about a month with tenor and realized I didn't really like it. I've thought about it in recent years and I think it is because when I was first listening to jazz, most of the people that I was listening to that my dad liked were alto players and we loved Jackie, Jackie McLean and Sonny Step on alto. So I think that's why I feel like I didn't want to do anything else.

Geoff: 10:08

What was your process for extracting the information from the solos that you heard? Did you take licks out and did you put those into your playing at some stage?

Camilla: 10:18

The thing with the transcription. At first, I find I've never been someone to write it down immediately, so I'm quite a slow transcriber. Even though I've been doing it for years, I feel I'm just slower at it. I don't know why, but I like to just get it down on the horn, make sure I can play it in all circumstances and speed it up, and then I'll take little bits, put them through the keys and then I mean it doesn't sound very musical, does it like?

Geoff: 10:47

force it into tunes but that is obviously, but that's as much of a technical exercise as well, isn't it to do? Yeah?

Camilla: 10:53

exactly and then modify it slightly, and then do that, do it again through the keys and then push it through.

Geoff: 11:00

That's fantastic. When did you start composing?

Camilla: 11:03

I think it was 2013. I did a gig with Courtney Pine. He decided he wanted to do a thing for women in jazz and it was called Venus Warriors, and a whole load of people were on there that I play with now, like Rosie Turton and Sheila Maurice Gray, I think, was doing it, oh, and Nabi was doing, actually, and they all had, I think they all had pieces and.

Camilla: 11:24

I came, I really like um Horace Silver's compositional style and I came with Nica's Dream and it was like, yeah, okay, this is fine, but you, why do you not have any of your own material? Why are you not composing?

Camilla: 11:39

And I just said, well, I don't really know how to do it and I just thought, well, you just have to start yeah and that was how, the year later, 2014, was when I started my band and you know I'm sorry to my band mates who I still play with but yeah, some of those early tunes were not good, but it was a vehicle for me to learn you know, yeah, yeah,

Geoff: 12:00

In your development, what part would you say jazz standards played?

Camilla: 12:05

Um, I think a large part up until a certain time. Um, so definitely, I went to Trinity whilst I was there and afterwards, it's probably when I did my second album and I started getting more into the writing, you know, because half the gigs would be standards for my band and then or an original that's basically written on a standard.

Camilla: 12:27

Well, I kind of moved away from that, I think, with the second album and then with the third album I was like I really like exploring my own stuff and I think again reference Kenny, but I really find his compositional style to be something that I've really want to emulate. I like the fact that his sound, his music, it's not accessible in that oh, it's selling out, but it's like it reaches you and It's catchy too, isn't it? Yeah?

Camilla: 12:56

yeah, and some of it's kind of like nursery rhyme-esque like sing a song but when you go to play over that, it's not that easy, and that's the thing that I like. It's like something that's making music accessible without it being. I'm going to do this thing in 13. Everyone knows it's difficult. None of the musicians are enjoying playing it, but, yes, I can play over it, and that's something I've kind of tried to move away from, I suppose.

Geoff: 13:21

But as a composer, you're in control, aren't you? You decide all that.

Camilla: 13:25

Yeah, exactly,

Geoff: 13:26

You're a little bit more in control of your own destiny, aren't you?

Camilla: 13:29

Yeah, definitely I make them play the stuff I want to play.

Camilla: 13:33

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so that's been a great part of developing a bit more as a composer, and I have a long way to go. I'd say it's something that I definitely feel needs working on.

Geoff: 13:45

It's like practicing instrument, isn't it doing composing? I compose a lot as well, actually, but um, you just get better and better at it the more you do it, don't you? Yeah?

Camilla: 13:53

I think so. I think my piano playing has improved, because at first it was just kind of me stabbing away at like terrible, terrible voicings and yeah, I've kind of got a little bit more understanding.

Camilla: 14:05

Yeah, I think now

Geoff: 14:13

So I have some apps. Brilliant. I sent you some apps the other day. Have you, um? Have you checked them out? Have you you had a listen?

Camilla: 14:20

I have. There's some amazing tunes on there and also it's just great that it's people in the rhythm section that I actually you know I saw Rod was.

Geoff: 14:30

Oh, Rod's on there, yeah, yeah, when he plays in my band. So I was like this is just like playing with him on the gig.

Geoff: 14:36

It was so funny when I had Rod in the studio. I don't think he actually knew what he was in for. He's on probably 150 of the tunes. But poor Rod was just like 'Are you joking'? But amazing, amazing, all with a click, all recorded with a click. You know that's the key in the studio. You know, to make it sound like it's not with a click, yes, Because it's all loopable, isn't you know?

Camilla: 15:07

it has to, it has to be. It has to be for the use of yeah, for people's usage, yeah, but it's great and so good to have an app with, with tracks that sound like music you know, yeah, I mean, I know you've got Aebersold stuff, but um well, that's where I grew up with listening to Aebersold music definitely, and there's some great players on some of those as well.

Geoff: 15:21

Some of them speed up, and then some of them are a bit dodgy, aren't they in places?

Camilla: 15:24

Yes, and I think I always find I hope I don't get in trouble with , but some of the kind of Latin swingy ones, like it always sounds a little bit like yeah, okay, no.

Geoff: 15:37

I know. So we're planning volume five and six at the moment. So, wow, trying to get a little bit more advanced as we go. So you know, three and four has Kenny Wheeler and Pat Metheny and some of these composers on it. So if you have any suggestions for tunes, please let me know. For five and six wow.

Camilla: 15:54

Well, I'm obviously going to say Kenny Garrett tune, that's a great idea.

Geoff: 15:58

I'm going to do that, yeah, so I asked you to pick a tune to play for us, and what did you choose?

Camilla: 16:06

I chose Peace by Horace Silver. Why did you choose that? I discovered Horace Silver when I was at Trinity. I found a book of his big band arrangements, or larger band arrangements, and I just really love his writing. I think, that his pieces really sound. I think they're quite distinct and some of my favourite standards have been written by him.

Geoff: 16:33

And again, just like Kenny Garrett, they're very catchy, aren't they, and very hooky yeah they are yeah. This is the backing track If you want to stick your headphones on. And then let's just see if you've got a balance and I'm going to have to turn your gain down of your microphone. What do you do for warming up? Do you have a regular sort of practice routine? What's your? Do you have a daily thing or um?

Camilla: 16:54

yeah, well, I do. Um, I I may manage to practice most days. I think Monday's the only day that I can't practice because I do a very long teaching day at school. But I have just recently started using a drone.

Geoff: 17:11

How do you generate the drone, then when does that come from YouTube, oh?

Camilla: 17:16

I didn't know you could do that. Yeah, you can just search it up. I'm always looking on these like sax forums and they're saying they do that for intonation and then I go through the kind of overtones series and some days better than others, depending on reed situation.

Geoff: 17:35

With a tuner, just to check your tuner.

Camilla: 17:38

I usually double-check um overtone with the actual um note. So I'll I'll just double check that and I'll match it um, and that's I mean unfortunately.

Geoff: 17:49

Can you demonstrate that for me?

Camilla: 17:58

So it's quite different, yeah, and. I'll spend time doing that. I mean obviously fortunately it sounds like a foghorn to everyone else. But so I do that, and then I like to do scales in three octaves so that my altissimo fingerings are the most useful, because it's all very well having these fingerings are the most useful, because it's all very well having these fingerings.

Camilla: 18:23

But then when you have something fast and you're kind of all over the place it doesn't work, and that's the thing I remember reading on an interview about Brecker and how he had this whole system for altissimo, which I mean I haven't studied in enough detail, really, and also it's tenor, so it might be so different, but I thought that was interesting, just being able to like economical use of fingers really yeah, to make the top end much clearer and much more in tune, I suppose also well, I mean, that's a struggle.

Camilla: 18:55

I don't, especially on alto, that's never, never, never fun, but um, but just also to be able to get up there and back down so you can do phrases with altissimo, which is what I'm working on moment and it being natural rather than being like, here's the altissimo a and then going off and do um so yeah, so I do those um scales and filters and then usually um a diatonic exercise, um, and I'll do that with a metronome in all keys and then I'll turn my attention to whatever.

Geoff: 19:28

And then you can put Quartet on and you have a choice of 500 standards Exactly there you go there, we go. Right. Thank you, um, um Thank you? Yeah, gorgeous, gorgeous. That's such an amazing tune, isn't it? I was just listening to that, just thinking about how differently A major sounds to D flat major, how the different tone centres.

Camilla: 21:48

Yeah, Do you know what I mean? I know what you mean. Yeah, it's weird, isn't it?

Geoff: 21:52

It's great yeah, let's just describe that tune so it's a minor 2-5-1 to G minor and then it goes to b major briefly yes, it's got that that real. And then to b flat major and then a major and d flat major. Yeah, it's gorgeous, isn't it?

Geoff: 22:09

Yeah, I've not really listened to that tune very much before

Camilla: 22:12

It takes my brain a second, because obviously I'm in a minor third below. Yeah, like.

Geoff: 22:16

So for me when it goes to the, G flat yeah and then it has the incidentally, sorry to interrupt, you know you can display the chords on here in e flat as well.

Camilla: 22:26

Oh yeah, it's a bind, isn't it having an instrument that's I find it okay on chords, but it's the dots, it's someone you know. You get people that don't realize that it's not in um. You're not in c in then why is that, though?

Geoff: 22:41

Why is that? Why not just call C, C? Huh?

Camilla: 22:46

I have no idea there is. I saw, yeah, I was gonna get. I really wanted to get one. I thought I have too many saxophones and then also be weird to play an alto in c and then go back to playing one that's in a flat.

Geoff: 23:00

Oh oh, that was absolutely gorgeous. How did it feel playing along with that backing track? Did it feel okay?

Camilla: 23:06

It's great. Yeah, it's great. I'm really looking forward to saying I've got this solo gig. I very rarely do gigs on my own for that reason, because it's hard finding backing tracks. And also the last gig that I did in this realm, in the fashion world, for London Fashion Week, I had to do one of the sets on my own as duo, so I had to go into Logic on the Aebersold ones and kind of get rid of that. You know one, two one, two, three, four. It just doesn't sell.

Geoff: 23:39

you know, actually, inside the app there's an upgrade. You can actually pay to have all the stems as well.

Camilla: 23:44

Oh wow, now I'm really looking forward to actually playing with those.

Geoff: 23:48

Are you someone who learns new tunes? Do you like to learn new standards

Camilla: 23:51

. I've been trying to do that. The thing with jazz, isn't it? It's like if you don't keep going on jazz, it just goes.

Geoff: 23:58

Unfortunately, that's because it's hard, isn't it?

Camilla: 24:00

It's really hard and I definitely feel that's something that you know I've been trying to force myself to do that. I mean, you don't always have the time to do it, but it's as nice as a project. You know to kind of do new tunes, yeah.

Geoff: 24:17

So what's the gig you're doing? Is it for fashion or something.

Camilla: 24:28

Yes, it's for a fashion house, an italian fashion house, and they are doing an event and they want music. Myself and my piano player, Renato, we played in Milan about a month ago um, and that was very Milan Fashion Week. Yeah, that was very cool and, um, yeah, we play as duo, but they want this now as just a solo, which is quite scary, I think. Yeah. It's a scary thing, I think as a sax player.

Geoff: 24:49

Is it a concert or something?

Camilla: 24:51

I don't think anyone's going to be listening to my music.

Geoff: 24:54

Well, just have a nice time and just play some standards. I'm just going to have a great time playing some standards which.

Camilla: 24:58

I never get to do. I had a great time playing some standards which I never get to do.

Geoff: 25:05

I've got a few questions for you, if that's all right. Maybe some of them are easier to answer than others. Okay, so the first one is what's your favourite album?

Camilla: 25:13

It has to be one. It's difficult, isn't it? Between Songbook, Ken Garrett and actually Bar Talk, which is by Jeff 'Tain' Watts, and then you've got all the classic ones that I love, but I'm just thinking in terms of what I really, because Bar Talk, I love it because it's got Mr JJ, which has got that amazing saxophone duel between Branford and Brecker.

Geoff: 25:40

Has that got that blues on it? That, yes, it does, I think it does.

Camilla: 25:47

Yeah, I think that's brilliant I, I just yeah, I mean I literally just put it on and it's like Mr JJ, and it's just so good, oh so good yeah so I think actually maybe that may top it, even though I love Kenny yeah, yeah,

Geoff: 26:00

It's difficult to choose a favourite album, isn't it?

Geoff: 26:03

I mean? Yeah when you hear that question, maybe your first impulse is probably the best answer. But yeah, I mean we know that there's so many albums that have influenced us yeah Is there a favourite musician, alive or dead, that you would like to play with?

Camilla: 26:17

Going in the same vein, I'd love to play with Tain. Um, I'd love to have been that, just that little rhythm section that Branford used, and I kind of you know, Kenny

Geoff: 26:27

I saw that band actually in the 90s.

Geoff: 26:29

I remember when they're in the height of that thing with Kenny Kirkland yes, yeah, yeah I saw them at Ronnie's wow actually in the 90s yeah wow, well, that would be my dream rhythm section. Yeah yeah, it was incredible, wasn't it? Kenny Kirkland is such a legend.

Camilla: 26:45

It's very sad that he passed so early.

Geoff: 26:47

Yeah, all of them amazing. Has there been a highlight of your career to date, a best gig perhaps?

Camilla: 26:53

I was very, very lucky to have sat in with Marcus Miller on a few occasions. Wow, the first time we were on the same circuit and we were supposed to be playing at a festival together in France, but he wanted to meet me on this other festival where I was not supposed to be joining him. Yeah, and I was like, oh my gosh, and he was so lovely.

Geoff: 27:13

How did that come about then? How did that meeting come about?

Camilla: 27:17

I think it's his manager is friends with my agent and they'd sent him a video or something and he said, oh yeah, I'd love to for her to come, you know, sit in or something. And yeah, he was great. And actually when I met him, you know, we had this thing and I went into the room, Then I left and I was like, oh my gosh, it's straight into Marcus Miller. And then his manager called me back and he was like he wants to speak to you again and I said, oh gosh, and he was like I'm really sorry, I think I called you Camellia instead of Camilla. I was just like you can call me whatever is fine, we were opening for them. We were like, yeah, we felt good about our gig, that's cool.

Camilla: 27:52

And I had actually gone to the toilet. When I came out the toilet, my band were like he just called you on the stage. He's just, he's called you up on the stage. He's like we told him you were in the toilet, I was like, oh no, so I had to, kind of I went off and I was just terrified. That was great but and I sat lucky to have sat with him in Europe a few times after that, but the main one was at Festival Hall for the London Jazz Festival in November, just gone, and that was because that was home ground and with Marcus, with Marcus, and it was amazing because for me his saxophone player is is amazing. His altissimo, just ridiculous.

Camilla: 28:35

I don't understand how he's just so controlled and you know, to be able to play next to him, and I just learned the whole set yeah and I think the idea was I just come on for one. But then and I kind of went to leave and then Marcus said I know you can stay on, so I played about four tunes, and it was that was probably my highlight. It was just great, I mean it's so exciting.

Geoff: 28:58

Oh, it's amazing. What a great, great experience. What was the last concert that you attended?

Camilla: 29:04

Kenny Garrett. Yeah. It was Kenny Garrett I went to. Embarrassingly for me, he was at Ronnie Scott's, I think, Thursday through to Saturday and I went every night.

Geoff: 29:15

Do you know him? Have you met him before?

Camilla: 29:17

Yeah, I have met him. I mean he now.

Camilla: 29:19

Yeah, I think he tolerates me, because it's just like what's her again

Geoff: 29:22

Fangirl yeah. What would you say to your musical weakness?

Camilla: 29:27

Oh gosh, loads of things um, making sure the horn's in tune. I mean, I play old saxes. That's always a struggle. Um, sometimes more successful than others. Yeah, ridiculously fast tempos sometimes I find that to be still kind of working, to be able to think quickly and to be able to play musically as well and I guess just hard tunes, hard music.

Geoff: 29:57

Do you ever get nervous on stage? Definitely, I actually just had an experience. Hard tunes, hard music, yeah, yeah, hard music, of course. Yeah, Do you? ever get nervous on stage?

Camilla: 30:03

Definitely. I actually just had an experience. I wasn't even on stage a couple of days ago and you have these experiences that you're like, oh it's gutting. A friend of mine's got and he's got an amazing big band. Shout out to Dan Casimir, his big band's project. His writing's amazing. But I think I was flustered. I arrived to the thing late and I just had a panic attack. I've never had that and when I came to solo I just couldn't. I didn't even know what I played. I know it wasn't good.

Camilla: 30:30

It was like I was outside of my body observing it. I think it threw me because I have now been playing for 10 years, so you don't imagine that that would happen in a rehearsal space. And, as I said, I got up with Marcus Miller and was like yeah, let's go for it.

Geoff: 30:49

What was the cause of that you think?

Camilla: 30:50

Probably stress from everyday life and also, I think, stress from being late. It was the reading aspect, which I consider myself an okay reader. I don't think that's my, you know I'm not a NYJO reader.

Camilla: 31:08

So I you know, I like to have a bit of time on it, and I think it was just this pressure of maybe being in a situation like that which I hadn't been in for a little while, and there being loads of musicians yeah some of them that I didn't know right, okay I don't know, it was very strange.

Geoff: 31:24

How do you feel when you play in front of other musicians, especially in other musicians that you respect? How does that affect your playing?

Camilla: 31:30

Oh, it definitely makes you nervous. There's always that vibe of like oh, and it takes me a little while, but it's something that I've worked on quite a bit, because I think when that happens, it's like you're not in the moment, are you You're thinking about? I wonder what they're thinking of my playing.

Camilla: 31:45

Yeah, I know, and then you've made a mistake. Oh no, I've made a mistake.

Camilla: 31:47

You're thinking about the mistake and then the moment's gone and you've not.

Geoff: 31:51

Yeah, it's hard, that's really hard, isn't it? Yeah. What's your favourite sandwich?

Camilla: 32:00

Probably, just a simple ham and cheese.

Geoff: 32:05

Excellent. What about a favourite movie?

Camilla: 32:08

Oh, that's easy. I make everybody watch this, Splash.

Geoff: 32:16

Oh, that's the Daryl, the Daryl Hannah mermaid one.

Camilla: 32:18

I'm obsessed with mermaids. I've written so many tunes about mermaids, and I found another one.

Geoff: 32:24

Did you speak to Tara Minton? You know Tara. Yeah, she made an album of something to do with mermaids, didn't she?

Camilla: 32:29

Did she? Yeah, okay, I'll check that out, for definitely.

Geoff: 32:32

Yes, listen to her.

Geoff: 32:34

What about a favourite venue?

Camilla: 32:35

Oh, okay, I would say UK it has to be Ronnie's, going to the jam sessions, meeting other musicians, etc. But outside of the UK it has to be Club Jasmine in Warsaw, Poland, because that place is amazing, it's for musicians, it's in the Nobu Hotel and they put you up in the Nobu Hotel, so that doesn't hurt, you get the lift down from your room to the to the venue, so that's great.

Camilla: 33:05

When we got to the green room, there was the usual rider plus all these other things and a PS5 which my bass player and drummer were like. I mean, they didn't want to do the gig, they were still playing. Whatever it was they were playing the sound is great on the gig and then afterwards they were just like the bar is yours.

Camilla: 33:22

Yeah, I mean, when do we ever get people saying that it's usually like here's you know Tesco's Meal Deal, and that's it

Geoff: 33:30

I played at a few different places like that, too, where you just you're in the hotel and you're playing in the basement. Yeah, in Stockholm, I think it was, there's a hotel that's owned by one of the guys from ABBA. Wow, I was playing there with Jamie Cullum. A concert theatre in the hotel, wow. Yeah, you can imagine, can't you?

Camilla: 33:48

Yeah, I can imagine.

Geoff: 33:50

What about a favourite country or a city that you like to visit?

Camilla: 33:54

I'm going to be disloyal to my Nigerian heritage. As much as I like Nigeria, I'm not going to say Nigeria, I'm actually going to say, uh, Portugal, okay, um, I really like going to Porto. I know that sounds very bougie, but, um, me and my mum have been going kind of regularly every year and it's just great. We took a trip on the Douro Valley thing. We just went on this boat and then we moored up and it was local wine and food as much as you could eat and drink. That was pretty lovely.

Geoff: 34:23

Does your mum live in London?

Camilla: 34:25

she lives about 30 minutes away from me so yeah, she's a another west London person

Geoff: 34:31

Excellent, excellent, okay so final question what's your favorite chord?

Camilla: 34:35

Do you know what, I write with a lot of these chords, and then I, I this is what I kind of fell off the wagon on that big band thing, sus. I love a sus chord. I just think that's that sound of a sus chord is probably. It's so hip and there's so many possibilities, I think, in terms of um playing over it

Geoff: 34:57

Um nerdy notation question. Would you prefer, like B, flat triad?

Camilla: 35:02

Yeah.

Geoff: 35:02

Over C.

Camilla: 35:03

Yeah.

Geoff: 35:04

Or C sus.

Camilla: 35:05

If I was playing, with my terrible voicings, on the piano, I'd probably go for the slash, but for in terms of as playing.

Geoff: 35:12

You like to see it written as a seventh chord? Yeah, yeah, interesting. So what have you got coming up? You got some some good stuff coming up, interesting.

Camilla: 35:20

So what have you got coming up? You've got some good stuff coming up. Yeah, on Thursday I'm going to Blue Night Milan.

Camilla: 35:24

Back again there, that would be nice, that's with your own group, with my band Fabulous.

Camilla: 35:29

And then on Saturday I've got the big band concert with Daniel Casimir at Cheltenham Jazz Festival.

Geoff: 35:36

Brilliant.

Camilla: 35:37

Yeah, and then we've got various things coming up. So yeah yeah, should be fun fabulous.

Geoff: 35:42

Well, good luck with everything and thanks for your time thanks very much and I'll see you very soon see you soon, bye, bye

Announcement: 35:48

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