Introducing Anita Wardell

Geoff 0:01

Hello podcats, Geoff Gascoyne here, hope you're well. Today I'm in South London, in my house actually. I'm going to be talking to Anita Wardell, jazz singer, scat singer, educator and a very close friend of the family, and we're going to be talking about things to do when you improvise. We're going to talk about her past and whatever comes up.

Geoff 0:24

So here we go.

Announcement 0:41

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Geoff 0:49

Anita Wardell hello.

Anita 0:51

Hey, Geoff, how are you doing? I'm good, thank you.

Geoff 0:54

Good Big day tomorrow, isn't it?

Anita 0:56

Yeah?

Anita 0:57

big day. Well, I'm actually not flying tomorrow, but I'm getting ready to go back to Australia.

Finding jazz in Adelaide

Geoff 1:03

So today's July 4th, isn't it? Yeah, and it's the next part of your journey.

Anita 1:09

Next, part of my journey. It's been a long, tough year but we're getting through it and thanks to you and Trudy.

Geoff 1:16

So you had a stroke, didn't you? 18 months ago, didn't you?

Anita 1:19

Yes, I did 16 months ago 16 months. Almost yeah, a year and a half ago,

Geoff 1:23

and the recovery's been slow, but we're.

Geoff 1:28

It's good. Now we're just on sticks and we're getting out and about.

Anita 1:31

Yes, and just like working on the mobility and you know, because my brain's not too bad.

Geoff 1:40

It's just the same as it ever was.

Anita 1:41

Yeah, just the same as it ever was yeah, Just got a bit of a dicky leg.

Geoff 1:47

So we thought we'd try and do this before you go. Shall we just talk a bit about your past and about how you got started and all that stuff.

Anita 1:54

Yeah, I started to learn music when I was at high school. I was quite a slow learner and I didn't really understand. I didn't understand anything about theory. I didn't know. I didn't understand anything about theory.

Geoff 2:04

I didn't know. I didn't even know what an interval was, a crotchet from a hatchet.

Anita 2:06

Yeah, project from a hatchet. My ear was okay, but I didn't understand anything about tuning or time feel or anything like that. I just, you know, I just thought, oh, I'm singing and that's it

Geoff 2:15

and this was in Adelaide, right in Australia

Anita 2:16

.

Anita 2:17

Adelaide, Australia. Yeah, I went to a school called Para Vista High School, which was in the suburbs, which is kind of a hard place to live with the sun beating down. Didn't know what hit me when I moved there and everything so, and then when I got there I was kind of like nearly high school age. So basically I had one more year of primary school and then I went into high school and that's where I started learning music and I loved it. I loved how it made me feel and you know I came from a bit of a tumultuous family and it was a great sort of saviour for me. You know, music it was where I kind of got myself together.

Geoff 2:53

When did you first hear jazz then?

Anita 2:55

Well, the music teacher that I had at school, kind of like, came from a bit of a jazz background, but it wasn't you know what. I know to know what jazz is now, if you know what I mean. So I um basically learned old songs, like old musical and vaudeville songs. Um, at first, like come, josephine, in your flying machine going up, she goes, and I just thought, wow, you know, like this is good. But then when I heard um started to hear things by George Gershwin and Cole Porter and stuff, I knew it to be something completely different.

Geoff 3:28

Did somebody play you jazz? Where did you first hear it? Do you remember?

Anita 3:31

So after I, you know, did a couple of years of high school, when I got to third year in high school I started watching more musicals on TV and I could sort of hear that the music sounded different. It was more melodic, it was more jazz based and there were definitely swing, feel and nice melodies and everything. I loved the words. Then I started to hear more sophisticated melodies and that sort of is what kind of made me feel really excited about the music. And then when I went to teacher's college we had some people that were really into jazz there, some teachers there, teachers college. We had some people that were really into jazz there, some teachers there, and he gave me a huge pile of LPs, John Coltrane, Sarah Vaughan, Ella Fitzgerald, Duke Ellington, Charlie Parker and Miles Davis and so I just listened, I listened, listened, listened and then I just thought this is the most amazing music I've ever heard.

Anita 4:22

What got me into jazz was that he was teaching these two girls next door Dizzy Gillespie's Birks' Works. So I heard these two girls going Sha-doo-ba-doo-ya-doo-ba-doo-ba-doo-ba-wee-boo-bop, sa-boo-ba-boo-bee-oo-ba-doo-ba-doo-bow, and I thought what's that? I want to do that for the rest of my life.

Anita 4:42

That's what made me feel like I'd found something that was completely different. So, anyway, I knocked on the door. I was watching through the little glass window and I was listening through the door, and when he came out of the room, I said what was that that those girls were doing? He said they were scatting. And then I was sold. I said I want to do that too. So those albums and listening to those girls is what made me decide that that's what I wanted to do,

Geoff 5:07

And what age would you have been when that happened?

Anita 5:09

I was 17. 17. Yeah, wow.

Geoff 5:12

And you started singing as a jazz singer, singer, did you, in Adelaide or did you move away first?

Moving to London and meeting Trudy

Anita 5:18

No, I basically joined the jazz choir because my teacher that taught choir met Kirby Shaw, who's a kind of a well-known choir director and arranger in America, and he came over and got a bunch of us together and taught us how to kind of approach jazz singing in a choir environment. That was really great. We learned the first chart that we learnt. Well, we learnt some easy ones first, but we learnt Birdland. So 5,000 light years from Birdland and I'm still living the rhythm. That's not that easy, is it?

Geoff 5:55

No, it's not.

Anita 5:57

And they gave me the solo, the Wayne Shorter solo, yeah, so I just fell in love with it. It was great. So that's where I actually learnt a little bit about phrasing. And then the teacher that showed me the scat singing, the girls that were scat singing, he got me into a little combo with him and some friends of mine and that's where I kind of learnt a little bit more about the style and I was a different person after that. I had a focus, I had something to do, something to concentrate on, something to live for.

Geoff 6:31

really, so when did you move away?

Anita 6:34

Well, I moved away because after I did the teacher's college they told me that I should leave the teacher's college and go and study jazz at the university. So I did that, Got my degree in jazz performance and then moved over to London because actually I decided I wasn't going to do jazz singing first, I was going to try and do acting. So I came over and I auditioned at RADA and I didn't get in because I was like 17 and they said it was too young and then go get some life experience. But by the time I had got the life experience I was doing gigs in Adelaide as a jazz singer and then after that, in about 1989, I moved over, started doing jazz singing full-time here and studied at the Guildhall.

Geoff 7:18

Yeah, yeah, yeah, is that where you met Trudy?

Anita 7:21

No, I met Trudy in 1984.

Geoff 7:24

That's my wife Trudy. No, I met Trudy in 1984.

Anita 7:26

That's my wife Trudy. Yeah, your wife Trudy, my best friend Trudy. And so what happened there was, I went over to Sydney and I was going to enter the jazz section of this singing competition, the Australian singing competition, and that's where I met Trudy and her mum, and so we hung out there and we had a good time and she was amazing, you know, because she had this great. When I saw her, she had this fantastic vibe on stage. She was like this blonde head, you know, like kind of Aussie rock.

Geoff 7:57

Aussie sex bomb, wasn't she? Yeah, Aussie sex bomb, yeah.

Anita 8:00

But she made me laugh and we had such a good time together and then, yeah, so that was really lovely meeting her there. And then when I came over here, I met her not long after because I'd gotten out of touch with her. And then, because I wasn't very good, because I was oh, I'll call you, I'll call you. And then of course, I get distracted. And then when I saw her in England, I couldn't believe it. And then I went and moved in with her, didn't I? You did, yeah.

Geoff 8:24

Yeah, then I met you and then I moved in with both of you.

Anita 8:28

Yeah, the Jazz Sheilas.

Geoff 8:29

The Jazz Sheilas yeah exactly in Clapham.

Anita 8:31

Yeah.

Geoff 8:31

Good days. So you've always been into scatting, but you're quite admired as a teacher as well, aren't you? You've done a.

Anita 8:39

I think I did the teaching because I was really helping myself. I wanted to teach people so that I could learn what I should do, Right, Because I didn't really know what I was doing. Even though I listened to jazz, it was still hard listening to the instrumentals and then like wondering what you do if you sing. But then when obviously he gave me those records Sarah Vaughan and Ella, I copied all Sarah Vaughan and Ella.

Geoff 9:05

So you sung along or did you transcribe, or anything like that.

Anita 9:08

I sort of transcribed by ear because I wasn't very good at understanding how you write rhythms down. So how long were you at the Guildhall?

Geoff 9:15

Tour. Did you do a one-year? I did one-year course, yeah.

Anita 9:18

I got so much out of it because I was under the tutelage of Pete Churchill Right was under the tutelage of Pete Churchill Right. He taught me about repertoire. It was like do you know this song, Do you know that song? And then a whole world opened up to me.

Making music while recovering

Geoff 9:30

So I've made some apps, as you know. You know all about my apps, don't you?

Anita 9:34

I love your apps. Yeah, I've been running Contrafacts we have actually. We just made an album.

Geoff 9:39

We made an album together, didn't we?

Anita 9:40

it was brilliant.

Geoff 9:41

Tell everyone about the album we just made.

Anita 9:42

Well, we just made this uh album. It's library album, isn't it? This is the second album we've done for them, but this, this second album, has been eye-opening because we wrote together over your uh Quartet we used it exclusively, didn't we? We?

Geoff 9:55

wrote eight, nine tunes in fact, all using Quartet absolutely all using Quartet and it was.

Anita 10:01

It was so great because the rhythm section is is absolutely top notch, so we used I Love You yeah uh, we use September in the Rain. What else is Willow Weep for Me? Yeah Moon River, Moon River, yeah, Moon River yeah, yeah, um.

Geoff 10:16

So we've written new melodies over the original changes and that is called a contrafact, isn't? It yeah so we've written lyrics and and melody and we re-recorded that, so we just used.

Anita 10:26

For the demos, for the demos, yeah. Which was? It was fun, wasn't it yeah?

Geoff 10:29

We did the vocals here.

Anita 10:30

Yeah.

Geoff 10:31

It was great In my studio.

Anita 10:33

Yes.

Geoff 10:33

And then we recorded a band While I was convalescing. Yeah on, piano bass and drums.

Anita 10:40

Yeah, um, sounds good and it's almost finished, so that should be out soon yeah, I'm really looking forward to it and I've got a very special place in my heart for this, because this is whilst I was getting better, you visited me a lot because Trudy and that were working, so I saw you a lot while I was getting well, yeah, and you got me back into music again yeah, so I used to come into the to Romford Hospital, which is where you first went to, I used to bring the guitar in.

Anita 11:03

Then we used to have a sing sing along, and we got that's when we got into our vintagy.

Geoff 11:07

Yeah, so we started listening to some of the old stuff, didn't? We yeah Mills Brothers, Ink Spots, yeah, yeah yeah, and we'd sing to some of the other stroke patients, didn't we?

Anita 11:16

yeah, we did. Yeah, emotional, it was emotional. I think we cried more than anything.

Geoff 11:20

Then, well, I did anyway, there were tears, yeah yeah. So today I'm going to get you to sing over a standard.

Anita 11:26

Yes.

Geoff 11:27

You've picked a tune for us. What song have you picked?

'Autumn Leaves' improvisation

Anita 11:30

I've picked Autumn Leaves because that's the first thing I started teaching people, because the chords were based on 2-5-1s in major and minor keys, and that, for me, was the first thing I had to get into. When I first started scatting, I didn't know that you had to spell out the chord changes in the beginning. Well, why else wouldn't you? Because, the thing is, you've got to be able to sing over something, haven't you? So that's what someone told me to do. They said why don't you do it on 2-5-1s?

Anita 11:56

So I learnt the 2-5-1s and I got the old Aebersolds out and started learning some licks, transcribing some licks by ear off the record, and and that's when I started realising it needs something more. I can't just go straight into licks. So I went back to the beginning and devised this programme where I just thought roots first, roots, thirds, fifths, sevenths stopped there for a while and did them with different rhythms and everything, and that's where I kind of felt like I was learning about the harmony of the tune.

Geoff 12:29

Yeah, so it was from the root up, always from the root of the chord up to the top.

Anita 12:33

Yeah.

Geoff 12:34

And then you finally got on to sort of upper extensions as well, did you yeah?

Anita 12:38

Yeah, and sort of some altered extensions, but actually that's been more recent in the last 10 years really because I've been doing this for about 30 years. But I've enjoyed the process and I'm not in it for a race, it's not. It's not that I wanted to. I wanted to learn it all quickly. I just wanted to learn it all so that I could actually access it while I was singing.

Geoff 12:57

I'll get you to sing it first, and then we'll talk about some of the teaching things afterwards.

Anita 13:02

Shall we, yeah, I'll sing the song first.

Geoff 13:03

Sing the song. Yeah, when we're not singing the melody, we we're just improvising. Yeah, just going to improvise, so there's going to be two choruses. A short introduction, as per Miles Davis. There we go Nice.

Anita 13:16

Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh.

Anita 13:38

Sada da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da did. So I'm going to sing a song called do fly up there up federal pay to be a better baby, to be a baby, do it another sad, sad papapa, baby, baby, papaya way Yay.

Geoff 15:38

Yay it was fun.

Anita 15:40

That was great. Yeah, my legs started to massively shoot out. Yeah, didn't they?

Geoff 15:46

That's what happened, didn't it Remember? In the hospital, as soon as you started singing, there was like all this movement from your leg, because your right leg was kind of paralyzed yeah, wasn't it yeah? And all this stuff, this involuntary stuff yeah yeah, that was lovely. I love the way you took your time and you paced your solo. Do you think of that when you, when you start a solo?

Teaching scatting techniques

Anita 16:04

I do now. I, when I was young, I just I used to just like have the most bizarre scat, sort of I just thought that you couldn't get in yeah but now I just like, maybe, maybe they're having the. The stroke has kind of changed my thinking and just take my time more you know?

Geoff 16:21

yeah, I don't know could be anything. So, um, going back to your teaching methods, do you want to demonstrate a little bit of what you're talking about?

Anita 16:29

yeah, I went slowly when I learned this, because I had to think about the rhythm, the feel and the harmony, obviously, and the melody, of course, because the melody and the harmony work together as well, don't they? But everything has to come together in the end, so I just did quite a lot of things separately, so I'll just show you what I basically did

Geoff 16:49

So should I put the backing track on again?

Geoff 16:51

and then, yeah, and you sing along. I mean you can play in the background and you can be singing, and you can sing the you know roots. Thirds yeah whatever you want, as we go along changing if you want, just to demonstrate some of the ideas. Yeah, okay, you're going to sing the roots to start with, just the first eight bars, yes, and then we'll go on to thirds. Then we'll go on to thirds, yeah, so here we go.

Anita 17:13

So that's roots with just basically long notes. Do do da Great.

Anita 17:28

OK, yeah, so that's roots with just basically long notes.

Geoff 17:33

All right, so sing the roots again, but vary the rhythm. This time.

Anita 17:36

Ok, right, let's do it again. Ok, ok, Do do, do, do do, do do do da Do ba do da diddle dee da do da. So how do you decide what?

Geoff 17:57

Syllables is a question I've always wanted to ask. What's okay? So the diddler doodlers?

Anita 18:01

I'm glad you asked, actually because tell me all about that. I, when I was young, I I don't think that I had the right syllables, because I always thought that my teachers told me that you should sound as much like an instrument. But I thought, well, the instruments want to sound like the vocalist, don't they? So I didn't understand. So I just thought, if you think about it as on and off beats, like do to me was like an on beat and the ba was the off beat. So I went in that.

Anita 18:35

So I just go do ba, do ba, and then do ba, do ba, do ba, and then just put the emphasis on different.

Geoff 18:37

Ah, that makes sense. Yeah, would you ever sing do as an up beat? No, Sometimes, it sounds wrong, though it does, doesn't it?

Anita 18:46

The do has got to be well, should feel longer than the ba. Yeah, do ba, do ba do ba, do ba.

Geoff 18:52

What about the diddlers? And that's triplets, is it?

Anita 18:54

Diddler, diddler, diddler. I used to teach people a diddler, because then you could get every single quaver, diddler, didd-da, diddle-da, diddle-da diddle-da, diddle-da.

Geoff 19:05

What about um 16th notes? What would you use for?

Anita 19:08

that so beautifully, beautifully, beautifully done.

Geoff 19:16

I got it from that right, so then I just went right, wow, yeah, do you have methods for that when you teach it?

Anita 19:25

Yeah, so I get people to read out of the book and sing. I was walking down the road and then I saw my friend and she said, hello, I'd make them read it, but I'd make them make up their own stories and get the right rhythms Right. Can you see that beautiful sunlit over there?

Geoff 19:44

Can you sing the first eight bars, just with some diddlers? Okay, go.

Anita 19:51

Diddler diddler, diddler doodah, diddler, diddler, diddler, diddler, diddler doodah, do-ee-ah-doo-bah, do-ee-ah-doo-bah, diddler diddler, do-bah-doo-dah, diddler, diddler, do. Yeah, in a way la-do-do-la-do-ba-do-da-do-la-do-la-do.

Anita 20:07

Yeah, it takes a, but you've got to. In a way, you've kind of got to do it over and over again to get the feel like in a smooth thing, yeah. And you could do the same thing with the thirds and the fifths, and the sevenths and the ninths and the elevenths and thirteenths.

Geoff 20:19

Let's do. Let's briefly do the thirds now, okay.

Anita 20:43

That's it.

Geoff 20:43

Yeah, because people don't get past that, do they? They don't get past that. That's a hard thing to hear, isn't it?

Anita 20:48

Yeah, it's like straight out of your brain you haven't got a key to press or anything, have you? No, and I've had a stroke, yeah.

Anita 21:15

You want to try the fifths?

Geoff 21:19

as well. Yeah, yeah.

Anita 21:21

Was that right? I think so, yeah. And then the seventh.

Geoff 21:24

Yeah, yeah. So that's just scratching the surface, isn't it?

Anita 21:27

Yeah, there's so many options. I started off on the roots because that was the easy place to start.

Geoff 21:31

Yeah so presumably, when you're practicing this, you sit at a piano and you have the notes, so you, yeah, really focus on what the notes actually are

Anita 21:39

Yeah, exactly yeah brilliant, it's mind-blowing, isn't it, yeah, just all that stuff, and then you get, that's when you get to the, when you solo and you, that's why you can do all those nice notes and everything because you would have practiced all those notes before yeah

Geoff 21:59

Can we finish off

Geoff 21:59

with a few questions I've got.

Geoff 22:01

Yes, yeah My first question is what's your favorite album?

Anita 22:05

My favorite album is Lambert, Hendricks and Ross, the Hottest New Group. I don't know if that's the original title, but that's the title that I've learnt it by and I just love it. It's part of every album that they've done and it's like Lambert, Hendricks and Ross sing Duke Ellington, Basie and it's incredible.

Geoff 22:26

Okay, so my next question is is there a favourite musician, alive or dead, that you would like to play with?

Anita 22:32

So it would be someone swinging for me, like maybe a swinging piano player, but then all the names elude me after my stroke, sorry to say it. It's all right, there's loads of them, but I obviously can't remember anything at the moment. Well, I love Herbie Hancock and he can play lots of different styles and stuff like that, but I loved those albums he did in the 60s, you know the ones with Wayne Shorter and stuff, yeah, all that stuff yeah. Speak No Evil, and I love that album.

Geoff 23:08

Would you say there was a highlight of your career so far or a memorable gig that you might have done?

Career highlights and personal reflections

Anita 23:14

Oh, the gigs that I did in the 90s at Ronnie Scott's were so, on. For me, because I'd never played at such a big jazz club, that was probably the last big jazz club. That was the first and probably the last big jazz jazz club that I played at yeah, right,

Anita 23:32

And hat was the last concert you went to?

Anita 23:35

you remember?

Anita 23:36

When I did the gigs at Ronnie's, I always saw the best bands before and after me. Joe Zawinul Zabinul, Joe joe Lovano, Betty betty Carter at Ronny Roddy Scott's. Yeah, I just loved that woman's phrasing so much because she was out there and she took risks and that's what it's all about, isn't?

Geoff 23:51

it. She was a proper improviser, wasn't she? She really was.

Anita 23:54

She improvised on the spot, yeah.

Geoff 23:57

What would you say is your musical weakness?

Anita 24:01

Everything. No, my musical weakness, think, is technique, vocal technique. I don't think that my. I don't mean like how fast I can scat or anything, but I mean in terms of quality of sound and just basic vocal training where your tuning is reliable and stuff. I'm a bit hit and miss with some of those things. I have to be honest yeah, you'll be nice.

Geoff 24:30

Yeah, you're talking about your break, maybe yeah because I know because we've I've recorded you a lot and we've recorded a lot together here yeah, and I have a break it's that place isn't it where it goes into. Is that what it's called? It's called a break, isn't it.

Anita 24:41

Yeah, it's like I. I kind of like flip, yeah, it goes from chest voice to head voice.

Geoff 24:46

Yeah, is that what happens?

Anita 24:47

Yeah, and I just don't think that I approach it right. I mean, I've still got so much to learn and that's a really good thing. It's like I want to have to have something to work for.

Anita 24:57

I don't want to be fantastic at everything you know, I've spent so much time learning to improvise that I need to spend an equal amount of time with my technique, all the technical stuff yeah, yeah.

Geoff 25:15

Do you ever get nervous on stage?

Anita 25:16

Oh yeah, all the time. Yeah, yeah. Why do you think that is? I think I think about what people are thinking about me too much those kind of insecurities that one gets when they're performing. And oh, I didn't do that right. Oh, I really hit that note sharp, or something. Instead of thinking, in the moment I'm singing on stage, doing what I love, I'm just picking holes.

Anita 25:32

I pick holes in myself all the time you see, hard on yourself, yeah, a bit hard on myself, yeah, yeah, yeah,

Geoff 25:36

Do you think you're um? In the last year, you think your attitude to music has changed?

Anita 25:41

I love it even more, and I and it makes me want to get better and better. I just don't want. I'm not a giver-upper, so You're not going to give up. No, I won't give up, I'll just keep searching.

Geoff 25:50

I'm sure you'll be back, you'll be back in the UK before you. Yeah, I mean, the idea is you go back and you recuperate for a bit and you see your mum and dad and all that stuff which you were actually going to do. 18.

Anita 26:01

Yeah, before I had the stroke, two days before the stroke, exactly yeah.

Geoff 26:06

So it's just a bit of a hiccup in your life, isn't it?

Anita 26:09

It is. There's been some improvement. As we said, it's been slow but, I'm going to get there.

Geoff 26:13

Yeah, I've got a few more questions. Favourite sandwich.

Anita 26:16

Favourite sandwich, cheese and onion.

Geoff 26:18

What about favourite movie? Favourite movie is Grease. No hesitation there, yeah, yeah, it's a classic isn't?

Anita 26:31

it. Yeah, yeah, I just love it. What about a favorite venue? The best place that I sang in was in Ancona and I did an outside gig and I met Dena De Rose and uh Martin Wind and I've forgotten the drummer's name, but they were all fantastic and it was one of the most beautiful gigs that I ever did. I did it with Steve Brown, Jeremy Brown and Robin yeah wow, uh.

Geoff 26:52

Do you have a favorite place in the world, a favorite country or a city?

Anita 26:55

I I am shared between that, because England's my home and Australia is my home, and I feel at home in both places. So I just love those two homes and, honestly, Australia is like a holiday visit anyway, isn't it? And coming here is just great because I love the countryside.

Geoff 27:11

Yeah, cool. Final question what's your favourite chord?

Anita 27:16

Dominant 13 flat 9.

Geoff 27:18

Nice, yeah, that's the chord that my Lewis has got tattooed on his leg, isn't it? He's got 13 flat 9 tattooed on his ankle.

Anita 27:26

Oh no, sorry, no, I lied, I lied, it's sus flat nine, that's what it is Nice. You know the 13 sus flat nine. Yeah that's it, that dark, lovely darkness.

Anita 27:36

Darkness great.

Geoff 27:37

Well, there you go. I think that will do it. Thank you, Geoff.

Anita 27:39

Thanks for having to you. Thank you for getting me back into music.

Geoff 27:45

It's my pleasure.

Anita 27:46

And thank you for being really you know nice with me on the recording and not making me feel like I was stressed. All right, see you soon.

Anita 27:59

Bye, see you soon, love you.

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