Welcome From South London

Geoff 0:02

Hello podcats. Geoff Gascoyne here. Today I'm in South London at my home. Actually, you can hear the birds singing in the background. And I'm expecting a visit from a wonderful young alto sax player called Alex Clarke. Alex is a fellow lover of Bebop, so we're going to chat a bit about that, about her influences, about her entry into The Young Musician of the Year, about her all-star quartet and her plans for the future. So I'm looking forward to having her around the house. So here we go.

Quartet App and Show Setup

Announcement 0:49

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Geoff 0:58

Hi Alex, how are you?

Alex 0:59

Hello, I'm good, thank you.

Geoff 1:00

Yeah, thanks for coming round.

Alex 1:01

Ah, no, thanks for having me.

Geoff 1:03

It's good for me to get some younger people on my podcast. I think I've had a lot of, shall we say, more experienced or seniors. Where are you off to today?

Alex 1:12

I am off to Battersea Park to play with the Ronnie Scott's Jazz Orchestra because it's really.

Geoff 1:16

Have you been playing with them for for long?

Alex 1:17

Yeah, I think it's been about three and a bit of years now. Yeah.

Geoff 1:20

Is it fun?

Alex 1:21

It's great, I love it.

Geoff 1:22

I spoke to Pete Long last week actually.

Alex 1:24

Oh yeah? Oh nice.

Geoff 1:25

Yeah, so here's he'd be a guest. I went

Alex’s Path Into Jazz

Geoff 1:27

round to his house. So can we start off with can you talk about your background and what got you into jazz in the first place?

Alex 1:32

Yeah, sure. So I grew up in Cheshire in a town called Congleton and kind of got into music through my school. I mean, I started playing piano when I was like five years old because there was one in the house and my mum played a bit and stuff. Then I got to school and realised that the piano wasn't a very sociable instrument, so I wanted to join like the school wind band, because this is in junior school. So yeah, I started like most kids on a recorder, and then that progressed to the flute. And then as I got into senior school, the school had a really good jazz band, and I wanted to be part of that, but I couldn't on the flute. So I got a saxophone and sort of hire it from the local music shop. And yeah, I think I my parents expected it to just be a bit of a flash in the pan and it not to come to anything, but I really loved it because of the similarities with the flute. I kind of and gave me an immediate kind of reason to practice and learn tunes and get things together.

Geoff 2:21

Were your parents musical?

Alex 2:23

Sort of. I mean, my so my dad isn't at all, but my mum played a bit of guitar and piano, and her gran was a concert pianist, so there is kind of music in the family, but a bit further back.

Geoff 2:33

Excellent, excellent.

Alex 2:34

Uh but yeah, I'm the anomaly otherwise. I'm an only child as well, so I didn't really have any siblings who are into music. And I think all along I kind of I knew I wanted to do music for a living from the age of probably about 11, 12, but maybe understandably my mum and dad were a bit kind of apprehensive about that being a viable career choice.

Geoff 2:52

Yes, I think that's a good thing.

Alex 2:53

And yeah, my whole time going through high school was spent trying to convince them that you know we can make this work. Right. And I think that inspired me to put in the work quite early on because I wanted to get to the point where I could prove to them and everybody that I could do it for a living.

Geoff 3:08

Great. And yet you go to music college after that.

Alex 3:10

I went to

Why Music College Did Not Fit

Alex 3:11

Birmingham Conservatoire, but I only lasted a year and then I dropped out.

Geoff 3:14

Did you? Why is that?

Alex 3:15

Oh gosh, I mean, yeah, I think the college environment wasn't right for me. I think I've always been one of those people that's enjoyed being busy and having to fit and practice around other things. And you know, I did loads of extracurricular stuff going through school, and then practice was always always the thing that I looked forward to and had to try and cram in as much as possible when I could, and then suddenly to get to college and it to be like the main event of the day. Yeah, I just went a bit insane, really. I thought, you know, everyone kind of compared each other and sort of said you've got to do seven hours in a room, and how many hours of practice have you done a day and all that kind of thing? And yeah, I found that environment actually it turned practice into a chore rather than something that I wanted to do and made me enjoy music less. And also the time that I was at Birmingham, there weren't many other people who were into the straight-ahead thing, and I kind of felt a bit on my own wanting to play Bebop, and there weren't many other people who wanted to do that with me.

Geoff 4:10

So did you move to Birmingham then?

Alex 4:12

Yeah, I did, yeah. I lived there for the year. Um

Geoff 4:14

I mean Birmingham's not the the centre of the jazz universe, is it? Let's face it.

Alex 4:18

There's a nice little scene there um of kind of graduates of the conservatoire that stick around, and there's some great players up there and people I still play with now, but I didn't want to go to London because I was worried about leaving behind the work that I kind of built up up north in Cheshire. But with hindsight, maybe I should have gone to London and I would have had a different experience. I don't know.

Early Gigs and Building Work

Alex 4:38

I mean it all kind of worked out in the end, but basically the end of my first year I got a job working at Warwick School, so that's why I moved to Warwick and why I'm still there now. And then the pandemic happened, so everyone else was kind of at college paying to not get tuition because it was lockdown. Whereas, yeah, I moved to Warwick and it was like a live-in job, so in exchange for doing a bit of boarding duty, I got to live on site for free and get three meals a day.

Geoff 5:03

So I kind of quite unusual, isn't it?

Alex 5:05

Yeah, right place at the right time. I got really lucky, and I loved that job, it was really nice, and they were super flexible with letting me have time off for gigs and

Geoff 5:13

So you were gigging all the way through this, were you? You had your own group, did you?

Alex 5:17

Yeah, so I the way I started gigging was I I started when I was still at school doing like GCSEs and stuff, I started going down to local trad nights and sitting in with old trad bands, and that's kind of alongside going down to my local sort of straight-ahead club, that was where I kind of learned the mechanics of the music and like how to follow form and hear changes and all that kind of thing. And then from there, he was like, Oh, the clarinet player can't make it tonight. Can you dep and that kind of thing? And I kind of built it up from there.

Geoff 5:44

Plus, of course, you can everyone's solos at the same time, don't they?

Alex 5:47

Exactly. It was kind of a good cover for like being able to make mistakes.

Geoff 5:51

Perfect. I think everyone should do that.

Alex 5:52

So yeah, I was already doing quite a lot up north and starting to um I got my own first little quartet together with some northern guys, and we recorded an album when I was doing my A levels. So I'd already kind of done that, and then to go to college and yeah, kind of leave that behind a little bit, and they weren't super flexible about letting me have time off for gigs as well. That was another kind of factor.

Geoff 6:14

Um

Young Musician of the Year

Geoff 6:15

and of course, I I need to ask you about the Young Musician.

Alex 6:17

Ah, yeah.

Geoff 6:18

Tell us all about that.

Alex 6:19

So that was again a thing that happened during lockdown, and I wasn't even really gonna bother applying because I don't know, the whole music being a competition thing isn't mixed feelings about that. But yeah, I was sort of at home and at a loose end and saw that they were looking for video submission, so I just submit submitted a video and didn't really give it much more thought. And then yeah, ended up getting through to the final round. So there was a heat. Um, the semi-finals happened down in Cardiff, and uh then yeah, the final was five of us, and we were all really different musically, which I thought was a really good thing. It didn't feel as competitive as I thought it was going to.

Geoff 6:56

Yeah, yeah.

Alex 6:56

And yeah, we played at Cadogan Hall to no people because it was lockdown. We just played to the three judges and the camera crew in a big empty room.

Geoff 7:03

Oh my gosh.

Alex 7:04

But no, it was a really cool experience, and I mean, fundamentally, I still don't think music should be a competition.

Geoff 7:10

I agree.

Alex 7:10

But it's totally something to stick on the bottom to an email to a promoter or whatever, and it's yeah, it's a nice thing to do.

Geoff 7:15

So I mean, did anything come of that? Did you did you make some contacts through that or did did anything specific happen?

Alex 7:21

I think nothing specific happened, but I think in general it just gave me a bit of credibility at a time when it was useful to have it, you know. Yeah, yeah. At the point in which I started my own quartet and wanted to um start getting gigs in my own name, um, it was definitely a useful credential to have.

Geoff 7:36

Yeah, yeah. I I was

Quartet Life and Phil Woods Links

Geoff 7:38

looking at you you have a a group with Dave Newton, Dave Green, and Steve Brown.

Alex 7:41

Yeah, that's right, yeah.

Geoff 7:42

So when did that quartet start?

Alex 7:44

Um so Steve joined us slightly more recently, but um yeah, I've been playing with the two Dave's for the last three or four years now. And yeah, I remember seeing Dave and Steve Brown playing with Scott Hamilton. I always Scott was one of my first sort of musical influences. I've always loved Scott's playing, and used to go down and see them at Pizza Express. And I always thought I'd really love to play with those guys. Um yeah, I feel very lucky to have them in my band now, and yeah, it's really great. And we've done we had a new album out last year, um, and then we've been kind of gigging that this year. And I think when you play consistently with the same people, lots you really feel that as a unit just really.

Geoff 8:23

How's it work logistically? You living in the Midlands, how how do you get together? What's what's the yeah?

Alex 8:28

I mean, so before we recorded, we all got together at Steve's place actually and like played through all the material and stuff, and then yeah, we see each other on gigs um and try and get there a bit beforehand and play through stuff. Yeah, and yeah, I do quite a few duo things with Dave as well on piano, so that's nice too.

Geoff 8:44

Fantastic.

Alex 8:44

One of my favourite people to play duo with.

Geoff 8:46

Fantastic, yeah. I was looking at your album this morning. I just want to ask you about one of these tunes, actually. Tell me about I Remember Phil.

Alex 8:54

Okay, so there's a quintet album with Brian Lynch on trumpet.

Geoff 8:58

Phil, which Phil are we talking about?

Alex 8:59

Phil Woods, this is

Geoff 8:59

Phil Woods. Ah!

Alex 9:01

Yeah, the album's kind of a homage to Phil Woods. I don't want to use the word tribute because I kind of hate that.

Geoff 9:06

I got that completely wrong because it started with some drums and it's it's it's over the changes of I Remember You.

Alex 9:12

Yeah, it's sort of. So yeah, there's this uh Phil Woods and Brian Lynch quintet album called, there's two volumes of it actually, Song Book One and Song Book Two. And they recorded I Remember You on that, and it's quite a quirky arrangement, and the changes are slightly different. So, like the bridge changes on my tune are those changes from the album.

Geoff 9:29

Yeah.

Alex 9:29

And I sort of took it through a few more keys and stuff.

Geoff 9:31

Yeah, yeah.

Alex 9:32

But I really like the idea of writing sort of semi-contrafacts. I don't do that much writing.

Geoff 9:36

Yeah.

Alex 9:37

Because I've sort of came in through the Bebop traditions, the swing and straight-ahead stuff. I never really did that much writing. It's always kind of been a bit of a regret. I'm trying to rectify that.

Geoff 9:48

Too late ?

Alex 9:50

So I thought a good way of getting into that is to write contrafacts and standard things.

Geoff 9:55

And uh and the other tune that I really loved was that World on a String. It's like this really beautiful contrapuntal.

Alex 10:01

Yeah, I overdone myself on the clarinet.

Geoff 10:03

So, yes, yeah, it was it's fantastic.

Alex 10:05

So that's uh again a Phil um chart from that same, I think I think it's from that same songbook uh collection. And um Phil admits quite openly that he was never a clarinet player, but he had a clarinet, and he always used to make a joke about it. There's some live recordings where he's talking about his clarinet playing on the mic and sort of playing it down. So I like the idea that I'm sort of a slightly ropey clarinet player as well, so I do the same and overdub myself on the clarinet.

Geoff 10:29

Fantastic, yeah. But it's good, it's it's good for you to be able to play all these different instruments though, isn't it? Clarinet, and you know, you're predominantly an alto player, but you play tenor and you and you told me you you bought a baritone as well. So this means of course you can you and this is how we met, isn't it? In a being in a big band,

Alex 10:44

exactly, yeah.

Geoff 10:45

And you can play all these different instruments. So of course that means you're flexible and you can you're available for lots of different kinds of work, I suppose, aren't you?

Alex 10:52

Yeah, I've always obviously my first love love is playing bebop with my quartet, but yeah, I've always had quite a diverse selection of work. In fact, I did a six months on 101 Dalmatians playing flute, clarinet, and alto, and that was an experience, let's say. I'm not sure I'm cut out for that that scene. Um the doing the same thing every night kind of killed me a bit, but yeah, it was a good experience, and yeah, I like to try and make myself as employable as I can.

Geoff 11:21

Yeah, yeah.

Transcription and Jazz Vocabulary

Geoff 11:28

Can we talk about vocabulary? Where did you get your a lot of your vocabulary from? Did you transcribe soloists?

Alex 11:33

Yeah, I did a lot of transcription early on. I never really sat down and learnt theory and learnt modes. I kind of came into it through transcription and listening. Um so I did a lot of Art Pepper and I did a lot of Phil Woods when I first started, they were my two, and Cannonball. Yeah, they're probably my three big ones.

Geoff 11:51

Not Charlie Parker?

Alex 11:52

Yeah, I got the omnibook and I did that, and I I love listening to Parker, but I didn't do that much proper, sort of deep transcription of him. Um, but yeah, a lot of Phil and a lot of I listened to a lot of Scott Hamilton and took down a lot of his stuff as well.

Geoff 12:05

Right.

Alex 12:05

I always I think coming from that sort of New Orleans background and sort of really rooted within the swing tradition, his music and his lines are so clear and melodic, it it really kind of lent itself to transcription when I first started playing.

Geoff 12:20

And would you typically write write these down and uh or just learn them by ear? What was your process?

Alex 12:24

A mixture, actually. I think a lot of people talk about the the idea of you shouldn't write it down, you should do it on your instrument, learn it on your instrument. But I did most of it writing it down first, actually. I'm quite fortunate or cursed that I've got perfect pitch. So I used to do a lot of writing like on the train, and as an ear training thing, I'd do it without any kind of reference, just write them.

Geoff 12:45

Interesting.

Alex 12:46

I think that's been very good for my ears, and then I'd take them away and and play them. And then sometimes I will learn things at the horn. Um

Geoff 12:53

When did you realise you had perfect pitch?

Alex 12:55

It was when

Perfect Pitch, Strengths and Traps

Alex 12:56

I had my first piano lesson when I was eight years old. And my teacher just did it as a bit of a test, you know, on machine. She she played me a note and then asked me to turn around and ask m e what it was

Geoff 13:07

So are you the sort of person that can pick notes out of chords as well?

Alex 13:09

Yeah. My perfect pitch works a bit weirdly actually, because first off, it's quite instrument-sensitive. So certain instruments like the piano and the sax, basically instruments I'm familiar with hearing in a jazz context all the time, I can hear really easily. If I'm, God forbid, doing a sax and DJ gig and I'm playing along with electronic music, I struggle to hear the tonality of that for some reason. And I don't know why. I think it's just the sonority and the timbre of the instruments is less familiar to my ears, so I struggle to hear it. But yeah, I kind of hear everything from the parent scale. So, you know, if I heard a B flat 7 sharp 11 play, I don't hear that. I hear F melodic minor.

Geoff 13:48

Interesting.

Alex 13:49

So I've been lazy and never learnt the mode of the .

Geoff 13:52

So you have the sound of the whole scale in there.

Alex 13:55

Yeah, I kind of hear the overarching thing, which is really useful in some situations, but then totally useless if I'm, you know, I suddenly get presented with a really roasty chart with loads of slash chords and stuff, and I actually don't know what to do with it. I have to hear someone play through it first. Really struggle to kind of read it off the bat. So yeah, it's definitely got its uses. It's made me feel always kind of okay with busking standards and you know doing it to singers where they're in different keys and stuff. But yeah, it's also made me kind of lazy and maybe not learn changes and tunes as deeply as I could have because I've always been able to sort of fall back on my ears.

Geoff 14:33

Right. Of course, that doesn't mean that you have good relative pitch, does it? It doesn't mean you can necessarily just play a melody, does it? Or does it? If you can sing it, you can play it.

Alex 14:42

Yeah, that is and the ear, brain, fingers, connectivity thing's always been a big one for me. Like when I first started playing, I always tried to I'd sing a note and then try and play it back on my horn. I've sort of actively worked at strengthening that relationship.

Geoff 14:56

I wish I had perfect pitch, but I don't. So can we talk about standards?

Standards, Love and Choosing 'Alone Together'

Geoff 15:01

What part of playing jazz standards has it played in your development?

Alex 15:05

I love the American songbook. I love how you can stay as true to the melody as you want to, in a way, you know, you've got license to be able to phrase how you want. And you know, I love playing Bebop heads as well, but there's an element of freedom you've got when you're playing like you're a vocalist that you know you don't get when you're playing a bop head and listen to a lot of Ella and Sinatra, and I just love all those tunes.

Geoff 15:28

And that's how you learn the tunes, presumably through the books.

Alex 15:30

Absolutely, yeah. I should be better at knowing lyrics, but I when I'm first learning them, I do always listen. Yeah.

Geoff 15:35

I asked you to pick a tune for us today. Which tune did you pick to play today?

Alex 15:39

Alone Together.

Geoff 15:40

Okay, and tell tell us about Alone Together. What is it you like about that?

Alex 15:43

I just really I I love blowing in a minor key. There's something really nice about that. Um and yeah, I like the fact that it's got a slightly irregular form. I think it's one of the first standards I've probably learnt, actually. So I've I've been playing it for quite a while.

Geoff 15:57

Well, I'll tell you what I like about it. You can play every kind of D, can't you? You can play D minor, D dominant, and D major.

Alex 16:03

Yeah, I've not thought about it like that.

Geoff 16:05

Yeah, that's I think it's a good it's a good thing. So let's

Playthrough 'Alone Together'

Geoff 16:08

let's get set up and then um and then we'll have a play-through.

Alex 16:11

Great. All right, okay, so we're gonna have two choruses. You will hear Graham Harvey's beautiful intro. Uh have a little have a little blow. Here he comes .

Solo Concepts and Diminished Language

Geoff 18:50

Killing. How'd it feel?

Alex 18:52

Good. I mean, it feels great to play with a really lovely rhythm section of my own.

Geoff 18:57

Have you used the app?

Alex 18:58

Yeah, yeah, I have. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, having grown up using iReal is quite the quite the upgrade.

Geoff 19:07

Oh, so t so can you give me a few kind of ideas that you may have used during that solo?

Alex 19:12

Oh goodness. Um I mean, a lot of my language is diminished-based.

Geoff 19:19

Yeah, yeah.

Alex 19:20

Um always thought about the five this is getting a bit niche now, but yeah, I've always thought the about the five chord as not really being the five chord. I've always just thought about it as being the diminished, built from the third of the five chord.

Geoff 19:31

Yeah.

Alex 19:32

Yeah, that's meant that obviously you kind of triple your language immediately because of the diminished axis. So yeah, I've kind of always enjoyed that sound. Um I'm never thinking in scales, that's never been the way my brain kind of works. I always remember, I can't even remember who told me this. One of my first teachers said to me, there's only two types of notes. It's either a chord tone or a passing note. And for some reason that's just really stuck with me that you know, chord tones are good.

Geoff 19:58

But you talked about Art Pepper and Phil Woods. Are there signature things that they do that you could you could cite? The things that may have influenced or inspired your playing?

Alex 20:09

Yeah, I mean Art Pepper does a lot. Um, in fact, this is a thing that's specifically from I think I might have done it just then, I'm not sure. Um, but on uh the Art Pepper Meets the Rhythm Section, You'd Be So Nice to Come Home To. That was one of my first transcriptions. He does the thing where he goes, that thing. I might have just done that then. Uh that was an Art Pepper thing. Um not much else about my playing really screams Art Pepper, to be honest. Like sound wise, I couldn't really be much more different. But yeah, I've always enjoyed his language. And then Phil Woods. The thing that first took me with Phil's playing is how much inflection there is in there. Um, you know, I think if anyone else played with as much vib and sort of bends into notes and stuff, it would sound really corny, but there's just something about Phil and like the openness of his sound whilst he's doing it, and that real kind of intention behind what he's saying.

Geoff 21:00

Can you give us an example?

Alex 21:01

Now I've got to try and sound like Phil Woods. I don't know if I can do that.

Geoff 21:10

So it's those little um, yeah,

Alex 21:13

but also he will use I don't tend to do this so much, but he'll use big kind of scoops up to notes, you know, big bends and things. And yeah, I've always just loved his feel and just his whole approach. He does just the right amount of quoting as well, I feel like it really annoys me when people quote other tunes and stuff all the time, but he'll make references in a way that just shows he's really deep within the music rather than it being like I'm gonna quote this here. So that's it. It always feels kind of organic, yeah, and I like that. Yeah.

Alto Sound and Modern Influences

Geoff 21:44

I think the alto saxophone, uh possibly more than the tenor and the other other saxophones, but seems to have so many diverse sounds. You you know, you take David Sanborn and and Paul Desmond, and I mean how different are it's like a completely different instrument. Don't you think?

Alex 22:01

Yeah, I completely agree. And I I always find the alto is quite sort of malleable in that respect. Um, I don't know, maybe it's because I've spent more hours on it, but I always feel like whenever I'm playing tenor, it's kind of like this is the tenor sound, and no matter which mouthpiece or whatever I put on it, I always just sound the same in a way. Whereas I feel on the the alto, regardless of the gig I'm doing, whether I'm you doing like a 1920s thing or whether I'm doing like a pop gig, I always use exactly the same setup. And there's just something about the alto that yeah, you can kind of beat it into something like that.

Geoff 22:32

So you can you can change the the the embouchure or something to get different sounds from it?

Alex 22:37

Yeah, I think it's partially like an airflow thing. I mean, obviously things such such as the speed of your vibrato uh obviously have a big impact and the amount of air you're using, but yeah, I think you can and this is getting into sort of saxophone nerdery, but um sort of your tongue position and how fast you sort of fire that airstream through and at what angle that can impact the sound quite a lot. And I never really like consciously think about those things when I'm playing it. It's more just when you're in a particular musical environment, you almost kind of go on automatically a your body your body knows what the right thing is to do in order to create the right sort of sound for that moment, you know.

Geoff 23:17

Is there a particular saxophone player that you would like to sound like if you had a choice?

Alex 23:22

Oh, that's a good question. I mean, sort of people that are around now, I really like Vincent Herring. He's kind of someone that I'm really into. And um

Geoff 23:31

What is it about his his sound?

Alex 23:33

I think it's the it's still warm whilst still being really direct and quite bright, still, you know, it's not too soft-edged. I like something with quite a lot of front at the start of the note. That's always been a personal thing. I mean, I've listened to a lot of Paul Desmond and that kind of thing, and I love it as well. But yeah, that's never been something that I've been directly going for myself. Yeah, I enjoy something that's sort of slightly edgy but still got fullness to it.

Geoff 23:59

Cool.

Alex 23:59

Yeah.

Geoff 24:01

Right,

Quickfire Favourites and Hard Truths

Geoff 24:02

I've got some questions now, which I ask everyone. I know. Question number one is what's your favourite album?

Alex 24:08

This is really hard. I should have thought about this because I have listened to your podcast and I should have known this was coming. Okay, I'm gonna have to say uh Phil Woods Live from the Showboat. I've talked about it before as being sort of a bit of a desert island disc to people, and we do a couple of tunes on it as part of this Phil Woods thing we've been doing with my band, and I always keep coming back to it. Uh, it's a slightly unusual album in terms of the sound, so it's a live recording, and it's with the Phil Woods Six, so there's guitar on it and percussion as well. And the recording quality isn't great, but there's just such a great spirit about the whole thing, and you can tell that the audience are like really into it and just a really great energy. And

Geoff 24:45

What year would that be?

Alex 24:47

I'm not sure, you know. I should really know that it's not massively modern. I couldn't put a number on it in case I'm wrong, but it's slightly one of his slightly later ones

Geoff 24:55

70s or something, perhaps?

Alex 24:56

Probably something like that. He's still in his prime because it's kind of sad, you know. Phil's uh latter years, he developed emphysema and was struggling to blow. He actually switched to a different horn, he started playing a Yamaha because it was a bit more free-blowing, and his sort of very very final recordings aren't reflective of him as a player at all. Whereas I think the sh the Show boat record, he's really kind of in his prime and it's it sounds great.

Geoff 25:20

Did you transcribe from that record?

Alex 25:22

Yeah, I did. I have a quintet with my friend Emily Masser, she's a vocalist, and we play in Scat um Phil's solo on Cheek to Cheek together as a as a thing with our quintet. And yeah, that's good fun.

Geoff 25:33

Amazing. Alright, question number two. Is there a musician alive or dead that you would like to play with?

Alex 25:39

I mean, I'd like to play with Jeff Hamilton. That's always been something that I've really wanted to happen. Um and I know that uh Dave Newton and Dave Green people have all worked with him and toured with him before, so it feels like maybe almost within reach. Yeah, I'd love to make that happen. Yeah, I've always just loved his feel.

Geoff 25:56

I think he comes over a bit here as well, doesn't he? He's been on a few record English records of late.

Alex 26:00

Yeah, I think so. So yeah, that's something that I'd love to happen in the not too distant future. Um and then apart from that, I mean I'd love to play with Vincent Herring, Eric Alexander, and Grant Stewart, all of those those guys. Yeah, love to do that.

Geoff 26:15

Amazing. Question number three: what has been the highlight of your career so far?

Alex 26:20

I don't think there's been one singular highlight. I think it's more just I'm happy with kind of what I'm doing now and I enjoy the diversity of it. And I yeah, I feel grateful that I'm able to play with my quartet, and I re they're like my favourite people to play with. And yeah, I feel every time I do a gig with them, I'm like, yeah, this is why I started playing music. And I think the highlight for me is almost like looking back to being, you know, 12 or 13 or whatever, and thinking, oh, maybe I could have a career as a musician, and my mum going, don't be ridiculous, go and do an academic degree. And yeah, I kind of feel immense satisfaction now in being able to go, I'm no, I actually did it, and I'm doing it. I'm working, and it's great, and I love it.

Geoff 27:02

Yeah. Do you ever listen to that first record you ever made you made? Do you ever hear that back?

Alex 27:06

Yeah, I do. There's bits where I'm like, oh, I still kind of do that, but yeah, a lot's changed. I'm pleased to say a lot of a lot's changed about my playing since then. And um, yeah, I think it's nice to have an early timestamp of my playing actually, because I haven't got many kind of recordings or videos or anything from my time at school when I was first starting.

Geoff 27:25

Yeah.

Alex 27:25

So it's kind of nice to have that as like a little reminder of where it all began.

Geoff 27:29

Here's a question. When you go in the studio, are you relaxed in the studio? Is your playing the same as it would be down 606?

Alex 27:37

I don't think so. I think I struggle in the studio. I find I say when we recorded um the latest album, we did it in Masterchord, and uh I was in a different room and I didn't have a line of sight to the guys, I was on a screen with them, and I did find that really difficult just to try and create a vibe when you're all in different booths. It is difficult.

Geoff 27:56

Are you conscious of the fact that you're you're recording? Does that affect you in any way?

Alex 28:00

I think it's less about the fact that the red light's on and more the fact that the sound's always super dry, and I'm not necessarily loving how my horn is sounding down my ears. And I think that probably changes the way I play. And that works on like a venue level as well. I'd always much rather play in like a small kind of basement jazz club room than a big kind of concert hall where you're all massively spread out on the stage and there's monitors and everything. Yeah, I struggle to you know feel the energy and really get things going in. Whereas if I'm playing a small little jazz club and it's all really kind of like sweaty and exciting, it's yeah, yeah, that's more conducive to good jazz, I think.

Geoff 28:37

Yeah, sure. So question four, what would you say was your musical weakness?

Alex 28:42

There are many. Um I think probably the not actually having quite a few gaps in my knowledge harmonically and being presented with changes that aren't necessarily standard and functional.

Geoff 28:54

Okay.

Alex 28:54

Yeah, I get thrown a bit.

Geoff 28:55

Um So if you're playing a Kenny Wheeler tune, for example.

Alex 28:58

Exactly that. And I think particularly my worst nightmare is playing a big band chart and turning it over and seeing a load of changes written out, especially when they're not formatted properly and they're not like four bars to a line and stuff.

Geoff 29:10

Yeah.

Alex 29:10

And I'm trying to read them, and I end up it almost feels like I'm kind of like batting them down as they come, and I can't sort of envisage the direction. Yeah, and that whole thing of knowing that there's a limited number of choruses and you've got to stop in the right place. I find that all really difficult, and I'd much rather just be busking a standard and free rein, you know.

Geoff 29:30

Yeah, you just want to play Bebop, don't you?

Alex 29:31

Exactly, yeah.

Geoff 29:32

Have you played much sort of Kenny Wheeler and any of that sort of European music?

Alex 29:36

Not masses, no. Um occasionally, you know, I'll be doing someone else's gig and a chart or crop up, but I'll admit I've not really spent that much time studying it and getting inside it. And

Geoff 29:47

it's a it's a it's almost like a different language, isn't it? In some ways. Yeah. You you can't play your diminished stuff on a on a Lydian chord, can you?

Alex 29:55

Exactly. Yeah, totally. In fact, I was tutoring on um the National Youth Jazz Collective summer school a couple of weeks ago, and um we all kind of bring different tunes down for the students, and yeah, some of the tunes that the other tutors have brought down were massively out of my comfort zone. I was actually finding I was getting stumped by some of the kids' questions. I'm like, that's not my bag, go and ask someone else.

Geoff 30:17

Yeah, well, it's good that you can do that. It's good that you can say that, you know, and and be honest about it because some people would say, All right, I can do this, I can do this, you know. But being honest, I think being to yourself is it's really, really important, isn't it?

Alex 30:30

Yeah, absolutely.

Geoff 30:31

Okay, question number five, do you ever get nervous on stage?

Alex 30:34

I get more nervous about what the other musicians are gonna think of me than than what the audience all think. Yeah, I think even playing in like large venues, if I'm doing a like a big band or an orchestral thing at a large venue, I don't get the whole thing. Oh, there's so many people out there, that's not made me nervous. But if I was playing with like a whole group of my musical heroes, even if I was only playing to two people, I'd still be really, really nervous doing that. Even as a kid doing sort of like school concerts and stuff, I never really got that nervous. And I feel grateful for that because I know that can be quite debilitating for some people, can I?

Geoff 31:12

But it's not that common to in jazz, especially, is it, to come across musicians that aren't receptive and open, is it?

Alex 31:19

There's gotta be an element of letting go and kind of not being worried about that in order to try and be creative. You know, if we're inside our two heads our heads too much, we're never gonna play well, are we? So we've got to leave that at the door.

Geoff 31:30

Yeah, I mean, playing with someone like Dave Green, for example. I mean, he's such a he's such a lovely man, isn't he? I went and interviewed him for my podcast, actually. I went up to his own.

Alex 31:39

Yeah, I listened to that one.

Geoff 31:40

I mean, he's just he's so lovely and such a lovely player, you know. Yeah. Um you can't think about what he's done. You can't think he's played with Sony Rollins. You you you just have to accept, you know, and and enjoy it, can't you? Exactly. Um crazy. Um kind of leading on for that, from that, the next question is have you ever been starstruck?

Alex 32:02

I don't think so. I've not really had the opportunity to meet I met Emmett Cohen very briefly when he was playing in Manchester. He had like two UK dates, and we did the support for him. And I was a bit like, oh, that's the guy that I've been watching the live streams of during lockdown. Yeah, other than that, I've not really had the opportunity to meet any kind of like real heroes, so I've not had that. It's a shame. I feel like I'm kind of born 50 years too late, really. I've kind of, I know I just missed out on being able to go and see Phil live, for example. And there's quite a lot of people that I would love to have had the chance to see and meet that I haven't been able to do.

Geoff 32:38

I was thinking about this last week, this week actually, Dolly Parton. I would have I never got to see Dolly Parton. Now it's too late. Alright, question number seven. What's your favourite sandwich?

Alex 32:55

Okay, this is gonna sound way posher than I actually am. I don't eat this all the time, but I love avocado and smoked salmon as a combination.

Geoff 33:02

Well, that's good.

Alex 33:03

But yeah, probably only have it about two times a year. But when I do, it's really good.

Geoff 33:06

Alright, what kind of bread?

Alex 33:07

It's got to be white bread. Yeah, so my mum wouldn't let me have brown bread as a kid for some reason. It was just a thing. So now, even age 26, when I'm eating white bread, it somehow feels a little bit rebellious and I really like it. Like a nice, chunky but soft

Geoff 33:22

with real butter?

Alex 33:23

Yeah, real butter. And maybe a bit of like mayo or actually quite cream cheese with uh smoking.

Geoff 33:29

With smoke salmon, that's a good combo, yeah. Right. Um, what's your favourite movie?

Alex 33:33

You're gonna be so underwhelmed by this answer. So, because I was um I didn't really watch that much telly as a kid, and I never really watched.

Geoff 33:42

Because you were busy practising bebop!

Alex 33:44

I'm now playing catch up, trying to watch more television and yeah, know a bit more about pop culture. But I'm afraid I'm gonna have to say Harry Potter, which yeah, I was a complete Potter fanatic, and I I still am. Um they're probably the only films that I've watched more times than I can count. Most things I've kind of watched once, and I'm like, now I know the plot, and now I don't need to see that again. But yeah, watch.

Geoff 34:05

Do you see new stuff every time you watch it? Isn't it?

Alex 34:07

Yeah, and it's at the point where I like to challenge myself as to how much I can like recite along with the actors. You know, I'm I'm yeah, I'm quite quite into it.

Geoff 34:15

Okay, very cool. What about a favourite venue to play in?

Alex 34:20

I love playing at the Pizza. Yeah, I just I like the sound in there, I like the vibe. There's just the right amount of background noise. That coming back to what I was saying about the right environment being um good, I think

Geoff 34:33

that's the Soho Pizza Express?

Alex 34:35

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah, just having that sort of table format and people are listening, and there's still a vibe, but it's not like everyone in those.

Geoff 34:43

Do you play there with your quartet?

Alex 34:45

Yes, I've yeah. We launched our album there actually back in October. And then I play with various people there. I quite like when you've got a big band there and you're all like really squeezed on, it's just a bit tight, but yeah, it's fun.

Geoff 34:56

Great. Have you travelled much? Have you have you got a favourite city, some would places you like to visit?

Alex 35:01

I like Paris. Um yeah, I used to go on holiday to France a bit as a as a kid, and I sort of speak slightly questionable French, but I can get by, you know. Uh so I enjoy going out then. Yeah. My favourite holidays, actually, um, which is a bit sad because I did it on my own, but I really enjoyed. I had a solo trip to Paris for a week with my horn, and I just had no plan whatsoever, but I just went down to gigs and met people and

Geoff 35:24

Did you practice under the bridge?

Alex 35:26

So yeah, I kind of just went around and and sort of sat in and went to jams and sessions and so on. It was a really fun week, and yeah, I loved the the whole kind of cafe culture and yeah, the actual culture there is great.

Geoff 35:38

Fantastic, that's a great thing to do, yeah. And when you travel, window or aisle?

Alex 35:42

Window. I like to rest my I I'm the worst traveller in the world. I will just fall asleep. If I'm in your car five minutes into the journey, I'll be gone. On the on the plane, exactly the same. Rest my head on the side, straight asleep.

Geoff 35:53

Good, good for you. Uh cats or dogs?

Alex 35:56

Cats. Yeah, grew up with two cats. And if I was at home more often, I would definitely have a cat of my own.

Geoff 36:02

Okay. What's the most used app on your phone?

Alex 36:04

This is bad, it's probably Facebook and Instagram, and I should do better because actually I don't really like social media, but it's sort of a necessary evil to promote ourselves these days and check out what other people are up to and stuff.

Geoff 36:17

Yeah, yeah. And the last question: what's your favourite chord? Oh. You can play it if you want.

Alex 36:22

Okay, it's probably like the diminished major seven sound, you know, the button over the dominant.

Geoff 36:29

Okay, just give us the notes.

Alex 36:31

So we got A flat, B, D, E, and G. So you got the diminished core, and then the natural in there as well. And over a dominant core. I just love that sound.

Geoff 36:44

And then and the note in the in the bass.

Alex 36:46

Uh B flat.

Geoff 36:46

Yeah, B flat, yeah. I'm tempted to play you recorded to the.

Alex 36:50

Oh no, don't do that whilst we're rolling.

Geoff 36:52

I won't do that, no, I won't do that. But uh I'm just jealous that you've got perfect pitch and I don't. That's great.

Writing More Music and Next Steps

Geoff 36:58

So, so what's the plans for the future? You you what's coming up with your your quartet?

Alex 37:02

We've got a few more dates this year. Um I tried with great intentions of trying to put a tour together of consecutive dates, but I'm not Nigel Price, so that didn't. So we've got a few kind of scattered tour.

Geoff 37:13

Get Nigel Price in your band, that will sort it out!

Alex 37:16

So, yeah, we've got a few remaining dates, and then we started getting a couple of bits and bobs in for next year, but I think next year, to be honest, is probably gonna be a bit more of a fallow year and come up with a plan as to what I want to do next. Definitely wanna think about doing some more of my own writing.

Geoff 37:30

Yeah.

Alex 37:31

I wrote a suite of music as part of um this Midlands kind of scheme where there was a bit of funding um for Alex Garnet and I to do this set of original music which was yeah, it was really, really fun, and that kind of it made me realise that actually I sort of can write, I just need to make the time to do it. So, yeah, that's something I definitely want to put a bit more of a focus on next year.

Geoff 37:52

I think it's important. I think everyone should write, in my opinion.

Alex 37:56

Definitely

Geoff 37:56

it's like practice but slowed down, isn't it?

Alex 37:58

That's yeah, I love that, yeah, definitely.

Geoff 38:01

Well, Alex, it's been it's been great having you around and thanks for coming.

Alex 38:04

Oh, pleasure, thanks so much, Geoff.

Geoff 38:06

And your beautiful playing, and I hope we can play together soon.

Alex 38:09

I hope so. Thank you.

Geoff 38:11

Bye for now.

Alex 38:11

Bye-bye.

Geoff 38:12

Bye.

Announcement 38:13

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Announcement 38:14

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